The Michael Richards Rant

[da12ken]

Video of the much-publicized rant where the"Seinfeld" star uses racial slurs at an audience member.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UomfLKQr57U&NR

[buckeyefan78]

That's pretty crazy. I wonder if it was staged or not.

[themush]

What would he gain by having something like that staged? Just floors me how people can still be that freaking ignorant.

[buckeyefan78]

What would he gain by having something like that staged? Just floors me how people can still be that freaking ignorant.

Well, they say any publicity is good publicity.

I'm not defending him (ploy or not). I think it was ignorant either way. Just saying ya never know what angles people have...esp. in Hollywood.

[themush]

I know you weren't defending him.

The one guy says he was never in any movies, I stand to disagree. Michael Richards was in the classic movie we all know as Airheads.

[Ellis]

Ever heard of Tony Clifton? He was a character that Andy Kaufman played, who would pull the same kind of stunts at his stand-up shows. The humor is more in completely confusing people than actually saying anything funny.

http://www.cineclub.de/images/2000/der_mondmann_1.jpg

[doublee]

I know you weren't defending him.

The one guy says he was never in any movies, I stand to disagree. Michael Richards was in the classic movie we all know as Airheads.

Not to mention he stole the show in the cult classic UHF.

Man, I am not defending him either and nor does it make it right, but it sounded like he had been enjoying a few adult beverages before he got on stage. His diction was sounding a bit slurred.

I don't think this is the first time he has flipped out on a heckler either. I seem to remember reading that he went off on someone else a few weeks back who heckled him. It was not nearly as tawdry as this but pretty bad nonetheless.

After hearing about this I am not sure when I will be able to watch Seinfeld again. I don't know if I will ever be able to watch it in the same light again.

[IntheNet]

Folks... this is a comedy club... if words upset you perhaps you shouldn't have gone in!
:rolleyes:
This guy could call Mother Teresa a whore and nobody would bat an eyelash but make a crack at a minority and suddenly everyone is offended. We have become far too politically correct in our assessments...

[BurghGuy]

I agree that we have become too politically correct in everything, but I do believe he went overboard. The N-word these days is a racial slur. That's what it is. It is an insult.

[tobynosker]

Originally Posted by InTheNet
Folks... this is a comedy club... if words upset you perhaps you shouldn't have gone in!

Then explain to me the joke, becuase there isn't one.

Michael Richards' rant is very different from the offensive nature of "Tony Clifton" because Clifton's comments were delivered in the same flow and format of an actual joke, and actually concluded with a punchline (which was always meant to be built-up like a typical humorous joke, only to end with an offensive or insulting comment; sort-of a backwards version of the famous Aristocrats joke).

What Richards did was curse and spout racial epithets without any intent to deliver an actual punchline or illicit a laugh.

You're right. It's a comedy club.

So if you are going to perform at one, do some comedy.

[bama4256]

You know a lot of people say southerners are racists and some are, but from my experiences living around this country in Boston, Des Moines and other northern or western cities there are a lot of white racists still living and from northern and western areas.

I don't care what anyone says, most whites are not crazy about blacks or other races as a rule. Most may say they don't have a problem with other races, but they do. And that is wrong if they have hate in their heart toward any race.

I've found people that say they are not racist will use that "N" word a lot when a black person does something wrong in their mind.

[IntheNet]

What Richards did was curse and spout racial epithets without any intent to deliver an actual punchline or illicit a laugh.

You're right. It's a comedy club.

I don't support what Mr. Richards said in the comedy club... I think it was in poor taste as well. However, it was a comedy club and such things are said in a comedy club all the time. In fact, if the two folks that took so much offense at the words used were genuinely serious about their outrage, they might clean up some of the language they traditionally use that the rest of us find offensive. There are many words that are offensive; it seems however that our politically-correct police only flag a few...why is that you think?

[tobynosker]

Originally Posted by InTheNet
I don't support what Mr. Richards said in the comedy club... I think it was in poor taste as well. However, it was a comedy club and such things are said in a comedy club all the time. In fact, if the two folks that took so much offense at the words used were genuinely serious about their outrage, they might clean up some of the language they traditionally use that the rest of us find offensive. There are many words that are offensive; it seems however that our politically-correct police only flag a few...why is that you think?

First off, the things that Michael Richards said are not used in a comedy club all the time -- especially in the context and with the rage in which Michael Richards chose to use them.

Secondly, how do you know that those who "were genuinely serious about their outrage" towards Richards' comments use language that "the rest of us find offensive?" You don't.

And thirdly, there are a number of white comedians who get away with making what the "politically-correct police" would perceive as offensive and insulting jokes about different cultures, races and religions.

But the difference between a Sarah Silverman joke and what Michael Richards said is "the joke."

Silverman says a number of things in her act that I know many people would find offensive. But Silverman says those things in the context of telling a story and at least attempting to illicit a laugh.

Like I said before, Richards was just spouting racial epithets without ever attempting to mix any "comedy" with it.

So don't try to confuse his comments with comedy, because that is not what comedy is and that is not how comedians actually approach controversial subjects in their acts.

[IntheNet]

So don't try to confuse his comments with comedy, because that is not what comedy is and that is not how comedians actually approach controversial subjects in their acts.

Sorry toby... I'm just not buying the double-standard here; last weekend I passed two young kids in an underground-parking lot and the language they used was far more offensive to me than anything Mr. Richard's is alleged to have said. These two kids made no pretense to hiding their off-color words. Trouble is... what these two kids said was offensive to me: a caucasian. What I find offensive doesn't matter and certainly isn't politically correct today. However, make a joke, crack an offense, utter a rant, and intrude gently or heavily upon a politically correct minority and suddenly one is pariah. It's the double standard that I object to. Once again, "I don't support what Mr. Richards said in the comedy club... I think it was in poor taste as well" however, understand its context; i.e., in a comedy club used by a comedian. Further, there are far more horrible things said, and in far more open areas. Let's hope our politically correct police open up their eyes... if we are going to condemn Mr. Richards (Cosmo Kramer character) then we have a lot of condemning to do and much of it is right out in the open and none of it is hidden in comedy clubs...Lastly, I understand Mr. Richard's apologized (http://www.cnn.com/2006/SHOWBIZ/Movies/11/20/richards.epithets.ap/index.html); you think I could ever get an apology from those two kids in the garage?

[tobynosker]

Originally Posted by InTheNet
Sorry toby... I'm just not buying the double-standard here; last weekend I passed two young kids in an underground-parking lot and the language they used was far more offensive to me than anything Mr. Richard's is alleged to have said. These two kids made no pretense to hiding their off-color words. Trouble is... what these two kids said was offensive to me: a caucasian. What I find offensive doesn't matter and certainly isn't politically correct today. However, make a joke, crack an offense, utter a rant, and intrude gently or heavily upon a politically correct minority and suddenly one is pariah.

I understand that there are people walking the streets and with whom you may come in contact with in the every-day world who may say things that are much more offensive than what Michael Richards said during his act that night.

But that has nothing to do with my prior post, so please don't confuse the issue.


Originally Posted by InTheNet
understand its context; i.e., in a comedy club used by a comedian.

Allow me to provide you an example of an insensitive and offensive joke involving race.

"There are only two Asian people that I know that I have any problem with at all. One is, uh, Guy Aioki. The other is my friend Steve who actually went pee-pee in my Coke. He's all, 'Me Chinese, me play joke!' Uh, if you have to explain it, Steve, it's not funny!" - Sarah Silverman, Jesus is Magic

The offensive comments were in line with a story being presented and included a punchline.

Insensitive? Yes. Offensive? Yes. Considered a joke (whether you find it funny or not)? Yes.

Now, a portion of Michael Richards' comments (when responding to a heckler):

"You can talk. You're brave now mother ****er. Throw his ass out. He's a ******."

Insensitve? Yes. Offensive? Yes. Considered a joke (whether you find it funny or not)? No.

Instead of presenting a story or ending his rampage with a punchline, Richards chose to specifically humiliate and degrade a paying customer, and then search for the most offensive and hurtful thing he could say to them.


What should he have done to deal with the heckler?

He should have said "Look, I don't come down to where you work and slap the dick out of your mouth."

Insensitive? Yes. Offensive? Yes. Considered a joke (whether you find it funny or not)? Yes.


All it would have taken was witty comment to shut the guys up, and then he could have continued on with his act.

[IntheNet]

I understand that there are people walking the streets and with whom you may come in contact with in the every-day world who may say things that are much more offensive than what Michael Richards said during his act that night.

Well excuse me... for taking offense and not being noteworthy enough to merit attention.

But that has nothing to do with my prior post, so please don't confuse the issue..

Not confusing issue at all; merely drawing parallels at existing double standard; one which society needs to overcome.

Allow me to provide you an example of an insensitive and offensive joke involving race.

You're right... that's offensive. I note that it was not reported by CNN. Can you guess why?

All it would have taken was witty comment to shut the guys up, and then he could have continued on with his act.

Agreed... however all it would have taken is for the major media to start looking at all people and all that that they say, not merely taking a look at their white skin and featuring them as the racist du jour...

[tobynosker]

Originally Posted by InTheNet
Well excuse me... for taking offense and not being noteworthy enough to merit attention.

When did I ever say that you were not "noteworthy enough to merit attention?"

Furthermore, I don't believe this Michael Richards incident is noteworthy enough to merit the attention it has received by the "major media."


Originally Posted by InTheNet
Not confusing issue at all; merely drawing parallels at existing double standard; one which society needs to overcome.

No, you are confusing the issue.

My problem was with your comments that "such things are said in a comedy club all the time," which couldn't be further from the truth.

Offensive and insensitive jokes are made at comedy clubs all of the time. Hateful and bigoted remarks like the ones Richards made are not.


Originally Posted by InTheNet
You're right... that's offensive. I note that it was not reported by CNN. Can you guess why?

I will wait for you to tell me...

[Anthony]

Well at least your side managed to split the doubleheader so to speak, IntheNet, in that the O.J. special has been canceled.

[tobynosker]

Originally Posted by InTheNet
the major media to start looking at all people and all that that they say, not merely taking a look at their white skin and featuring them as the racist du jour...

And they are, considering the scrutiny that East Palo Alto Vice Mayor Peter Evans is facing. (http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/local/states/california/peninsula/16045593.htm)

[IntheNet]

My problem was with your comments that "such things are said in a comedy club all the time," which couldn't be further from the truth....
Bobcat Goldwaithe. Chris Rock. Doug Stanhope. Margaret Cho.

I will wait for you to tell me... I believe I already have; the major media - for years - have used a double standard on their reportage of racial statements. White men of European origins are held to a different standard for their use of racial epithets than all others. If any one of the above uttered what Mr. Richards said, exactly as said, the major media would probably not report it. Sadly, all have, in various ways.

[buckeyefan78]

Did anyone see Letterman last night (note: I had to set my alarm to watch it...so pathetic)?

Jerry Seinfeld was on there and they had Richards join in via satellite from L.A.

It was really awkward and disturbing IMO. Dave's audience first thought the idea was gonna be a humorous take on the situation and you could hear giggles coming from the crowd as the interview began. At one point Jerry told the crowd to stop laughing as Richards tried to explain his actions. Richards demeanor was kinda hard to describe. He seemed upset, confused, and unable to really express his emotions on the incident. Weird.

[tobynosker]

Originally Posted by InTheNet
Bobcat Goldwaithe. Chris Rock. Doug Stanhope. Margaret Cho.

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. And wrong.

Please point me to one example of when any of the above named comedians decided to viciously attack a specific member of their own audience and degrade that person solely on the color of their skin.

If such an example exists and that comedian was not taken to task by the "major media," then you have a double-standard.

If your basis for a double-standard comes from the fact that one of the above-named comedians has used race within the context of a joke, you are perpetuating a double-standard that doesn't exist.

Michael Richards was not using race in the context of a joke, and was instead spouting off racial epithets in an attempt to humiliate and degrade a human being.

And things like that do not go on at comedy clubs all the time.


Originally Posted by InTheNet
Sadly, all have, in various ways.

Just to point out, wrong.

[HibachiDG]

Did anyone see Letterman last night (note: I had to set my alarm to watch it...so pathetic)?

Jerry Seinfeld was on there and they had Richards join in via satellite from L.A.

It was really awkward and disturbing IMO. Dave's audience first thought the idea was gonna be a humorous take on the situation and you could hear giggles coming from the crowd as the interview began. At one point Jerry told the crowd to stop laughing as Richards tried to explain his actions. Richards demeanor was kinda hard to describe. He seemed upset, confused, and unable to really express his emotions on the incident. Weird.

I caught it on youtube today, http://youtube.com/watch?v=dufHYw-W6j4

Thought it was weird as well. Not really sure what they were laughing about, I assume that since it was taped in the afternoon, they hadn't heard about what happened and that they thought it was a skit of some sort, but that was very awkward. They should have prepared the audience for a bit more. I don't even know what to make of the Letterman appearance, I think you nailed it in that he seemed unable to really express his emotions. The Katrina comparison he tried to toss in there didn't really help things a whole lot.

[IntheNet]

Please point me to one example...

Find out if I can post such a thing on this board... there are two Chris Rock videos I am aware of and a couple of text transcripts from Margaret Cho that offer clear representation... I recall a Bobcat Goldwaithe routine that I heard personally and someone forwarded a link to a piece from Doug Stanhope that is well over the top and directed personally at one person in a nightclub and is not nice in any way...

[tobynosker]

Then PM me with the information if you don't feel comfortable posting it on this message board.

EDITED: I am a big Chris Rock fan and have seen every single one of his television specials. I have never seen Rock "viciously attack a specific member of (his) own audience and degrade that person solely on the color of their skin."

It would seem very interesting to me if Doug Stanhope said anything remotely close to what Michael Richards has said since Stanhope once received "a scathingly racist and anti-semetic E-mail" from the Amarillo Comedy Club when they decided they didn't need his services (http://www.ereleases.com/pr/2002-05-03a.html), and because he might face closer media scrutiny after he announced his candidacy for the Liberterian Party nomination for President in 2008. (http://stanhope2008.com/)

And it has been well-reported the amount of racist and homophobic hate mail that Margaret Cho received after she made a joke about President Bush. (Her joke was "Bush isn't like Hitler. He would be if he applied himself." Offensive? Yes. Considered a joke? Yes. Different from Michael Richards' hate-filled comments? Yes. Yes. Yes.)

[Marc]

Seinfeld is making the rounds promoting Season 7 of the show on DVD, and I can only wonder if this is a publicity stunt that coincides with that. But I'm thinking no since it's not exactly going to make people want to buy the DVD!

IntheNet, I am appalled you are actually defending Richards. No one enters a comedy club expecting to be specifically attacked based on their skin color. That's a far cry from them being prude. toby is 100% right here. Richards' actions are INEXCUSABLE and his career is over. You should be ashamed for trying to twist that incident into anything other than a disgusting display of racism and hate.

The difference between racial jokes by people like Chris Rock is one, they are jokes and done for laughs in a light-hearted manner, and two, he is not attacking his audience. Oh, and you can post the videos ... and by the way, even if there are examples of racism in the past, that doesn't justify it one bit...

[buckeyefan78]

I never thought of that Marc...the DVD angle. Yeah, it coulda been a ploy to sell the DVD but I think you're right...that ain't somethin' any marketing firm would come up with. After seeing the incident in full and the coverage of it I don't think it was some kinda angle for profit/promotion.

It does sound kinda naive but I'm with doublee on watching Seinfeld now (not to offend ya doublee...lol). It will just seem weird. I know you really don't know people but after seeing this it will just keep poppin' in your head when you watch the show...

Kramer went on a racist tirade.

Weird.

[doublee]

Seinfeld is making the rounds promoting Season 7 of the show on DVD, and I can only wonder if this is a publicity stunt that coincides with that. But I'm thinking no since it's not exactly going to make people want to buy the DVD!



No, but I would bet that Seinfeld engineered the whole apology deal on Letterman last night hoping that this incident won't kill the DVD sales.

[buckeyefan78]

No, but I would bet that Seinfeld engineered the whole apology deal on Letterman last night hoping that this incident won't kill the DVD sales.

True too.

So it's doublee who is the mastermind behind all of this. :P

[doublee]

I have no comment towards my alleged involvement in such things. Nor, do I have any such recollection of such discussions that may have happened pertaining to said incident. :D

[Tarkus]

I don't know why anyone gives a rat's ass what he's said. I know I couldn't....

[Ellis]

I still think that it is a hoax. Both Letterman and Seinfeld were laughing in the beginning of the interview. Also, just the way they worded things seemed odd. Jerry telling people to stop laughing, Jerry saying that he was upset about it, and the way Richards worded a lot of things just seemed odd.

Also, he addressed the situation on Letterman? Just all seems odd to me.

[bama4256]

Letterman and Seinfeld are two odd guys.:lol:

[buckeyefan78]

I don't know why anyone gives a rat's ass what he's said. I know I couldn't....

Fine then.

Next time I throw a little fiesta in the Hollywood Hills your ass ain't invited cuz you don't want to lower yourself to this ancillary bullcrap.

Too bad for you. You'll be missin' out on free liquor, chicks, and door prizes! :thumbup:

:P

[doublee]

So, what is the over/under on when Richards checks into rehab?

[boston_aloha]

I still think that it is a hoax. Both Letterman and Seinfeld were laughing in the beginning of the interview. Also, just the way they worded things seemed odd. Jerry telling people to stop laughing, Jerry saying that he was upset about it, and the way Richards worded a lot of things just seemed odd.

Also, he addressed the situation on Letterman? Just all seems odd to me.

Did you see Richards?? He went nuts!! I saw the clip on youtube... he just went off... weird... not a hoax though...

[Tarkus]

Fine then.

Next time I throw a little fiesta in the Hollywood Hills your ass ain't invited cuz you don't want to lower yourself to this ancillary bullcrap.

Too bad for you. You'll be missin' out on free liquor, chicks, and door prizes! :thumbup:

:P

:lol:

Then again, it's not as tho my view is set in stone...:P

[boston_aloha]

I read on yahoo today the two men that he yelled at "want an apology and maybe some money" said their lawyer.... LOL

Simple apology is not enough we want $$$ This is so pathetic LOL

[Tarkus]

Yea, pathetic indeed, Steve. Apparently the only way to salve their wounded feelings & humiliation is to wrap themselves in cash to leech out the poison...:rolleyes:

This idiot lawyer of theirs, Gloria Allred, is a prime example of talkin' out both sides of your mouth. She once called Arnold Schwarzenegger a Nazi sympathizer & Justice Clarence Thomas an Uncle Tom. Now she tries to nail Richards for the same type BS. Stunning...

She also proclaimed that by excluding females, the Boy Scouts were committing gender apartheid. :confused: This is the type of attention whore lawyer that's the basis of the joke "what do you call 100 lawyers at the bottom of a lake? A good start...".

She's just making this whole thing worse. I especially love this line... "He singled them out and he taunted them, and he did it in a closed room where they were captive." Yea, like they were held hostage.:rolleyes:

What a bunch of F'n idiots...Starting with Richards & all the way down the list...

[kirby]

As so typically happens in these cases, what we see on tape is only part of the episode. The Rodney King beating is a case in point. The public was not treated to a viewing of that methed-out psychopath threateningly menacing the police officers. He took a well-deserved @ss kicking, yes. Like a wild animal he needed to not only be subdued, but also punished.

In this Richards case we don't see what happened prior to him verbally slapping the offending patrons. They no doubt were at the very leastloud, selfish and obnoxious. At worst they were verbally abusive to the man providing entertainment for them.

The rude patrons (who don't understand civilized society) initiated the episode, and Mr. Richards proceeded to give it right back to them, and then some.

They started and HE finished. Nothing but respect for that. Learn your lesson.

[HibachiDG]

Kirby I don't think anyone would have given Richards any grief had he done what you said and just give it back to them. He decided to not do that, though, and make the comments he made. Many comics do what you described...Richards, he was not even close.

[doublee]

I agree with Doug. It is not as though we have heard from anyone else who was present in the audience come to Richards' defense and say that he was provoked or that the guys he unleashed on started slinging racial slurs at him first.

[HibachiDG]

It's kind of funny how as this goes on, Jesse Jackson comes out looking almost as bad as Michael Richards...

He's calling for a boycott of the Seinfeld DVD...ignoring that many others benefit from the DVD sales that did NOT make racist comments. Now...he wants to ban all entertainment use of the word Kramer used.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/6191188.stm

There's one article, but google news is changing them quickly, there are so many. The hell with Jesse Jackson and his manipulation of causes for attention. The notion of banning the n-word in all entertainment circles is short sighted, naive, bigoted, and hopefully they laugh him out of the room.

And who are you? So full of hate that you have to fight everybody, because you've been whipped and chased by hounds. Well that might not be living, but it sure as hell ain't dying. And dying's been what these white boys have been doing for going on three years now, dying by the thousands, dying for you, fool. And all this time I keep askin' myself, when, O Lord, when gonna be our time? Gonna come a time when we all gonna hafta ante up and kick in like men, LIKE MEN! You watch who you callin' ******! If there's any ******s around here, it's YOU, just a stupid-ass, swamp-runnin' ******! And if you not careful, that's all you ever gonna be!

And a white man in that movie used the word in a just as proper manner. Just because Richards abused the word in an entertainment setting, but not as part of entertainment I would argue, Jackson wants to ban people from using the word in any entertainment? The hell with him. Jesse Jackson talks so damn much about racism, but he certainly has not proven to me that he knows what racism truly is.

[Marc]

I saw that call to boycott Seinfeld and majorly rolled my eyes. Jackson is an overreacting idiot. I'm sick and tired of people like him whining and moaning. This is 2006, not 1960.

[kirby]

D & d, Richards didn't berate those beligerant jerks with any wording that they don't routinely hear BLACK "entertainers" use. But now he's public enemy #1. Just a touch of irony there.

Hey, nobody publicly came to his defense because the climate in this country is such that public figures don't dare offend the black community or the media in our country excoriates them.

Predictably, the only patrons given tv time were those who expressed outrage over his words. I can guarantee you that there were patrons there who were LTAO at the way he ripped into those losers. Go read the "comments" posted following the Richards Rant clips posted on youtube. A lot of them were people who thought he was a funny man.

He was. Funniest thing I've seen in 2006.

[catman]

If Jesse Jackson wants to have the "N" word banned, he had better be sure to tell Chris Rock and other black comedians about it. They use it a lot.
In this situation, the blame lies soley at the feet of Michael Richards. He is a professional and should be able to handle a "hostile" crowd better than he did. Perhaps his timing was a bit off that night and the audience was somewhat disappointed.
This is a situation where a person lost his cool under duress and no amount of apologies will make it right.

[boston_aloha]

Yeah, you know - I thought maybe it was his "act" at first, like a wierd twist?? But it was just wrong and stupid.... one of you guys said it ealier "how long till he checks into rehab" He must of been on something, or maybe he just hates black people?? Kind of sad IMO cuz I watch Seinfeld reruns all the time, I love that show, and the cast, and it just does NOT seem like Kramer, ya know?

[buckeyefan78]

This is 2006, not 1960.

Not to single you out Marc and actually this has nothing to do with this Kramer issue, but when people say things like this it really makes me wish that they could experience what I've been thru...even more than usual.

At that point I just usually stare at the globe or out the window til the bell rings though so don't mind me. ;)