Golf

[SpiderMBA]

Golfer Tiger Woods was named "Male Athlete of the Year" for 1997 by the Associated Press. My dictionary defines "athlete" as "a person with the skill and training to be good at sports". "Sports" is "the playing of games or participation in competitive pastimes involving physical exertion and skill". Sorry, gentlemen, but there is no physical exertion involved in swinging a golf club. As for the walking, that is merely incidental to playing golf. In fact, many courses do not allow walking. If exercise were an important element of golf, then the pros would not ask a caddy to carry their clubs for them. Golf is not a "sport" and golfers are not "athletes". To be an athlete, you must work up a sweat, and then hold it for a spell.

[Ross]

I guess you haven't came upon the golf forum yet, have you? Could someone please move this there?

[Nate]

Done, Ross.

Ah...gotta get out of here! I'm in the golf forum! :eek:

[RaviPachai18]

Alright, why don't we try a different approach. Obviously you have something against the game, may I suggest you actually go out there and try to play it? Right from dictionary.com:

-----
sport (spôrt, sprt)
n.

Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.
A particular form of this activity.
An activity involving physical exertion and skill that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often undertaken competitively.
An active pastime; recreation.
-----

Can golf be considered physical activity? Yes...is it governed by a set of rules? Yes...so can it be considered a sport? Yes...

Is it an active pastime? or recreation? Yes, it is.

Is it a sport with a large amount of physical exertion? Well that's left up to interpretation...do we run around the course? no, we don't but I invite you to go out and play a round of golf for four hours in pouring rain, or 100 degree weather.

To be an athlete 'you must work up a sweat', that is one of the most uneducated comments I have heard in all my life. You will be amazed to find out there are quite a few 'sports' where you don't necessarily 'work up a sweat'. You might also be amazed to know that if you watch golf, you might actually see the players sweating.

I find it funny how you can question the validity of golf as a 'sport' when it is widely accepted as a sport and rarely disputed (to my knowledge). If you can't understand why golf is considered a sport, I don't think anything I've said here will help but I decided to respond anyway.

Ravi

[SpiderMBA]

Ravi, I too looked up both "athlete" and "sport", and cited the definitions, chief of which was "physical exertion".

Now YOU may consider an occasional swing - in fact as few as 59 of them, and as effortless as a tap-in putt as "physical exertion", but I do not.

Yes, I have tried it. Golf is absurdly difficult.
Whoever defined "par" was an idiot.
Whoever made the cups so small was an even bigger idiot.

Try tennis some time.
Tennis players:
1. Hit a MOVING ball. I repeat a MOVING ball
2. Hit the ball while running themselves
3. Don't sit around and admire their shot because they have to haul ass across the court and get the NEXT shot
4. Sweat
5. Breathe heavily, almost every game.

Golfers don't do any of the above. Oh, I know, Tiger Woods likes to pump his right arm after he makes a good shot. At least that little arm pumping gets him SOME exercise.

heh heh heh

[lmanchur.]

Funny thing is.. this guy makes a few good points. I mean, golfers don't even carry their own equipment!! The caddys do that, fix divots, wash clubs/balls, keep track of every shot, hold the umbrella, etc., etc., etc.

However, there's a reason golf is a sport. How about walking up courses along the sides of mountains in places like Japan? Walking it one day is difficult, but four days in a row is extremley difficult... and to walk it AND hit a golf ball in the process is even more demanding.

If you don't consider golf a sport, or Tiger Woods an athlete, then David Wells of baseball shouldn't be considered an athlete, either. He doesn't even work out!!... however, what he does have is an excellent skill -- a skill to pitch a baseball to the plate... just like Tiger Woods has a skill to hit a golf ball.

[Nate]

Man, I gotta stay out of this forum! :D

Anyway, as much as I dislike golf, I must concede and agree that Golf is a sport. It may not be as much as of a sport as football or basketball, in my opinion, but a sport none the less.

[RaviPachai18]

SpiderMBA,

Physical exertion does not define a sport, it may be part of a sport. Any modern dictionary will have multiple definitions of which golf will fall under at least one.

Ravi

[SpiderMBA]

Ravi, YOU posted the following definition of "sport". FIRST you said it "involved physical exertion", and then you later said golf does not.
(Here comes a hard question for you.)
Which is it? "Physical exertion", or no "physical exertion"? Make up your mind. I already made mine up. I'm consistent.
SpiderMBA
////////////////////
(Ravi's original definition follows)

sport (spôrt, sprt) n.

Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively.
A particular form of this activity.
An activity involving >>>>"physical exertion"<<<<

[RaviPachai18]

Well if you had taken the time to go to Dictionary.com and search for sport you would notice that each one (except the first two as they make an entity) is an entity. Along with the 3 I gave are another 6 which make a total of 9. Now maybe you can read my above posts and put it all together. You might even see that I am consistent in what I'm saying.

Ravi

[SpiderMBA]

And then again I might not.

[SpiderMBA]

Ravi, that's SOOOO persuasive . . . so intellectual. The more definitions the better, huh?
And is Dictionary.com the foremost authority on definitions?

Good one, Ravi. No, really.

[RaviPachai18]

hahahahahahaha now we're going to debate the validity of Websters. Seems like you can only reply with sarcasm...don't worry I didn't expect anything more from you. Keep going you're on a roll...

Ravi

[lmanchur.]

Originally posted by RaviPachai18
hahahahahahaha now we're going to debate the validity of Websters dictionaryactually, the official web site of the Websters dictionary is M-W.com (http://www.m-w.com/dictionary.htm), not Dictionary.com ;)


:D :lol:

[RaviPachai18]

I didnt say it was the official websters website...if you type websters.com it goes to dictionary.com thats why I called it Websters.

Ravi

[lmanchur.]

Rreeeeeeeaaaaalllllyyyyy?? Well, how about that!! ...learn somethin' new every day...... and of all places to learn that!!! :D

[SpiderMBA]

SC-Lee, YOU da MAN!

Taking sides with an insouciant outsider like me.

I like it, Lee. It says that you think for yourself. There are so few of us left any more, eh?

"I slept and dreamed that life was joy.
I awoke and saw that life was duty.
I acted, and behold: Duty was joy."
- - From the Sanskrit

"Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing."
- - Helen Keller

[SpiderMBA]

heh heh heh
Ravi didn't have a comeback for those replies, did he . . .

He's probably out practicing his tap ins. . . .

[Richard the Lionheart]

Quoting Helen Keller doesnt change the fact that you are wrong. Fact is, if you dont think golf is a sports, youve never played it before. Believe me, it is a LOT HARDER than it looks on tv. I suggest you play a round sometime, then report back to us. Im almost somewhat interested in what you have to say, surprisingly.

If things like softball, bowling, and Nascar are considered sports by many, then certainly golf is.

[SpiderMBA]

Ricky, I didn't make up the definition of sport.
You don't like the definition, go take it up with Noah Webster.

Now if difficulty were the measure of a sport,
growing up would be a sport, raising kids would be a sport, figuring out life would be a sport, and war would be a sport. But difficulty has less to do with the definition of sport than exertion.

You just let me know when you "exert" yourself playing golf, would you?

Meanwhile, I made a par 5 on a 500 yard uphill hole last month at Anaheim Hills; hit the island first try at Redhawk, Temecula; and got a birdie on #6 (275 yards) at Rio Hondo.

You want some REAL sport, meet me on the tennis court, cowboy. No butt wigglin' there, just runnin and sweatin.

[Richard the Lionheart]

Well, Its obvious we both have our own opinions and we wont convince each other otherwise. The whole thing is objective and it doesnt even really matter what its classified as. Its pretty much pure opinion.

[SpiderMBA]

There ya go, Ricky!
I just wanted to say that golf is pretty much a wuss game.

heh heh heh

[RaviPachai18]

Ricky, why waste your time on a lost cause? I learned that a few posts ago. Spider, you have your definition of a 'sport', I've presented a logical arguement which disputes everything which you have produced in this thread, noone has to do anymore to show you you're wrong. If you don't want to believe something, noone can make you believe it, but if people continue to fuel your stupidity it will turn into a thread where everyone says that they believe what they believe and nothing will be achieved.

By your standards golf isn't a sport, oh well, we should all just drop down and worship you for life. I'm inclined to say you think it's a wuss sport because you're probably very bad at it and you can't accomplish anything by using your brute force. So you go on, waking up every morning and telling yourself that golf isn't a sport, I'm sure you'll accomplish something someday. For me, I've got better things to worry about. BTW, I'm not expecting a response with a high level of intelligence, so you'll probably be best saving your time and energy..but then again, I'm sure that won't stop you from posting.

Good Luck :goof: :D :)
Ravi

[SpiderMBA]

MY REPLY TO RAVIPACHAI, "MODERATOR", FOLLOWS.
I INTERPOSED MY RESPONSE IN UPPER CASE AND [IN BRACKETS BELOW].
SPIDERMBA

01-09-2002 04:40 PM

RaviPachai18
Moderator

Ricky, why waste your time on a lost cause?
[SO NOW I'M "A LOST CAUSE". THANK YOU, RAVI. YOU'RE SO . . SO . . . "MODERATE".]
I learned that a few posts ago. Spider,
you have your definition of a 'sport', I've presented a logical arguement [SIC] which
disputes everything which you have produced in this thread, noone [SIC] has to do anymore to show you you're wrong.
[RICKY OFFERED HIS POST THAT THESE WERE MERE "OPINIONS". how, PRAY TELL, CAN AN OPINION BE WRONG? TELL ME, MR INTELLECTUAL?]

If you don't want to believe something, noone [SIC] can make you believe it, but if people continue to fuel your stupidity [FIRST YOU CALLED ME "A LOST CAUSE", NOW YOU REFER TO MY "STUPIDITY". PLEASE NOTE THAT YOU, NOT I, MISSPELLED "ARGUMENT". PLEASE NOTE THAT YOU, NOT I, MISSPELLED "NO ONE". MORE ABOUT THINGS INTELLECTUAL LATER ON. YOU WILL RUE BRINGING UP THAT SUBJECT SO IMPUDENTLY, SIR.]

it will turn into a thread where everyone says that they believe what they believe and nothing will be achieved.
[SO THEN PEOPLE ARE NOT FREE TO "SAY WHAT THEY BELIEVE"? AND HERE I THOUGHT AMERICA WAS A COUNTRY WHERE FREE SPEECH WAS TOLERATED. "STUPID" ME.]

By your standards golf isn't a sport, oh well, we should all just drop down and worship you for life.
[1. THIS IS A RUN-ON SENTENCE. YET YOU CONDESCENDINGLY ATTACKED my "STUPIDITY".
2. WHERE ON EARTH DID YOU GET THIS RIDICULOUS NOTION OF "WORSHIP(ING) ME FOR LIFE"??? THAT IS PLAIN GOOFY!]

I'm inclined to say you think it's a wuss sport because you're probably very bad at it and you can't accomplish anything by using your brute force.
[POSTING AN OPINION IS "BRUTE FORCE"? MORE SILLINESS FROM YOU, SIR. IF WORDS ARE "BRUTE FORCE", THEN WHAT DESCRIPTION HAVE YOU FOR A PUNCH IN THE MOUTH? OR FINES AND IMPRISONMENT IMPOSED BY A GOVERNMENT? HAVE YOU NO HONESTY, AT LONG LAST? FOR THAT MATTER, HAVE YOU NO INTELLECT EITHER?]

[FURTHERMORE, THERE ARE MANY ACTIVITIES THAT I AM "VERY BAD AT", BUT WHICH I RESPECT FOR THE STRENGTH AND FITNESS THEY REQUIRE, E.G. SOCCER. WHETHER ONE IS A GOLF PRO OR A DUFFER, THE SWING AND THE WALK DIFFER ONLY TRIVIALLY.]

So you go on, waking up every morning and telling yourself that golf isn't a sport, I'm sure you'll accomplish something someday.

[ANOTHER RUN-ON SENTENCE FROM A MAN WHO CAN NEITHER SPELL, WRITE PROPERLY, AND WORST OF ALL, CANNOT THINK RATIONALLY - RAVI. AND YOU HAD THE AUDACITY TO ATTACK me FOR "STUPIDITY". . . .]

[I CONTINUE. I WAS A MILLIONAIRE BEFORE I WAS FORTY. HOW ABOUT YOU? I HAVE TRAVELLED THE WORLD. HAVE YOU? I AM AN ACCOMPLISHED SCUBA DIVER, SNOW AND WATER SKIIER, BIG GAME FISHERMAN, TENNIS PLAYER, MARATHONER, ETC, ETC. I HAVE A WONDERFUL WIFE OF 33 YEARS, AND A DEGREE IN CHEMISTRY AND AN MBA.
AND YOU HAVE THE TEMERITY TO ACCUSE ME OF "ACCOMPLISH(ING) SOMETHING SOMEDAY". INDEED, YOUR IGNORANCE AND HUBRIS ARE INCREDIBLE.]

For me, I've got better things to worry about. BTW, I'm not expecting a response with a high level of intelligence,
["NOONE" HAS SEEN MUCH BY WAY OF INTELLIGENCE FROM YOU, SIR. THEN LEARN TO THINK. THEN LEARN TO BE DECENT WITH SOMEONE WITH A POINT OF VIEW TO RAISE. THEN LEARN TO SPELL. YOU HAVE YOUR WORK CUT OUT FOR YOU.]
so you'll probably be best saving your time and energy..but then again, I'm sure that won't stop you from posting.

[THOUGH YOU WOULD SEEM TO WANT TO SHUT ME UP. I FIND THAT COMMON THEME IN LEFTISTS.
SPIDERMBA]

[Marc]

Folks, let's handle ourselves and not let this get out of hand. No personal insults of any kind are allowed here, doesn't matter who's doing what. This is fair warning, I don't want to have to close this thread. Thank you.

[SpiderMBA]

"GOLF" - I played 15 holes with a friend yesterday, beginning at 1 PM.
He has been golfing for some years, while I am a
newcomer to the game, having only played regulation 18 hole courses on 20 occasions.
(I'm keeping a log.)

Now, to allay Ravi's concern that my remarks are
merely those of a "really bad golfer", let me say that I beat my friend quite handily. I shot a
52 on the front 9, while he shot a "53". Since he paid my way, I didn't argue his creative method of scoring. A mulligan here - a mulligan there.
He counted his many out of bounds drives as one stroke each when he did take them. But hey, I'm not complaining, just reporting facts.

I outdrove him repeatedly, and most dramatically on our last tee, where we merely teed off and then left. He hit out of bounds short on the right.
I hit my best tee shot, about 230 yards straight down the pipeline. That's about the best I've ever done, but I've done it at least 5 or 6 times.

He asked that I not tally the back 6 holes.

How about tennis, Ravi? How's your tennis game?
I been hitting THAT moving ball two to three times a week for over 20 years. No time to admire your shot. You gotta run back to center court and get ready all over again. Tennis is a REAL sport.
SpiderMBA

[lmanchur.]

Originally posted by SpiderMBA
How about tennis, Ravi? How's your tennis game?
I been hitting THAT moving ball two to three times a week for over 20 years. No time to admire your shot. You gotta run back to center court and get ready all over again. Tennis is a REAL sport.This is a dumb, dumb argument.

Really, neither golf NOR tennis compares to hockey. Ice hockey is the "ultimate" sport -- the reaction time of tennis is required; you got the phsyical nature of football; the grace of baseball and figure skating; the speed is unlike any other.... hockey players are the top athletes on the earth. Anyone can pick up a ball or raquet or club and run around and play tennis or golf or basketball or football or baseball. Hockey requires a talent to skate that, as you all know if you've tried it before, can be quite tricky.. and to do it with twenty pounds (not really but you get my point) is harder; to do it with a puck is harder yet; and to do with with heavy equipment and a puck and 11 other players on the ice is even harder, and when you have to ram into 'em and also navigate that puck with pinpoint accuracy at top speeds on a nearly frictionless surface . . . . it's just that, quite simply, NO other sport compares to it in ANY way.


So now, can you all shut up and end this argument?
I've won.
Thank you.

[Marc]

Simply put, each sport has its advantages and disadvantages. Every sport has something special, perhaps a quality, that makes it special in its own way. I think it is impossible to compare different sports and come out with a clear conclusion. Let's leave it at that.

[RaviPachai18]

agreed :D :goof:
see Lee, told ya you should come to Western.

Ravi

[lmanchur.]

Originally posted by RaviPachai18
see Lee, told ya you should come to Western.What?? That one flew right over my head.

[Richard the Lionheart]

First off, a 52 isnt that good. I was shooting in the 50's when I wasn 14.

And second, quit with this golf bashing stuff. At least golf isnt a girly sport like tennis.