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View Poll Results: Who do you think is right? NHLPA or the NHL Owners?
NHLPA 4 30.77%
NHL owners 9 69.23%
Voters: 13. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-08-2004, 04:56 PM   #1
canucks_bertuzz
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Angry NHLPA vs NHL Owners

I think this is started to get out of hand. The players of the NHL shouldnt need 1 million a year never mine the higher amounts! If we can live with working for less that a million a year I think the players can to! I see the owners point, they cant just give away that kind of money every year. I admit the players are good but no one needs a million dollars a year maybe every 2-3 years.

I realized that we have two idiots as the presidents of each side of this disagreement so I believe the NHL will have a SHORT stoppage of play!
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Old 09-08-2004, 06:09 PM   #2
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Hey there canucks_bertuzz, what's your name!?? ...My high school English teacher was from Dryden Welcome to the SCMB!!!

I have a hard time agreeing with either. NO person "needs" or "deserves" the average of $1.8 or whatever an NHL player makes... but they have to be compared with people who do similar jobs (other pro atheletes) and in THAT comparison, they do deserve a few million. But, it is out of control. Gretzky never even earned $6 million until his last few years, imagine what he'd get now if he played like he did in the 80s!! It's not really the players' fault that salaries are out of control, it's the owners and GMs who will do anything to win. I can see the players' POV... the market should determine the wages. This off-season, because of hte uncertain market, salaries have gone down, but why did it need to come to this for them to decline!?... Most teams could get the elite players at modest prices, but as long as there are those 2 or 3 teams that will pay ridiculous amounts for even average players, some sort of a cap or salary structure IS needed.

So, I see both sides and I really don't care for either one. If I HAD to choose, it'd be with the owners but I wish they'd just meet half way so that training camp could start next Wednesday.
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Old 09-08-2004, 06:31 PM   #3
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Good points lmancur ...... until the owners will open up the books to the players union, there can be no trust. If they are so deep in debt (which I believe they are), then why not just prove it.
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Old 09-08-2004, 09:45 PM   #4
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personally I think a salary cap is good for any and every league. Then maybe my D-Rays might have hope in baseball (not likely).
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Old 09-09-2004, 08:36 AM   #5
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A salary cap isn't good enough, they need a salary bar as well. Doesn't the NFL have one?? Even if MLB set a reasonable "cap" for their luxury tax to kick in, like maybe $90 or $80 million, it still doesn't give teams spending $25 million a chance. Everyone should be kept in the same spending limits and I think the combo of a salary bar AND a salary cap is great
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Old 09-10-2004, 03:46 AM   #6
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Actually even now without a cap the Lightning won, hek ya, and they have one of the lowest payrolls in the league. They just did it the right way with drafts, coaching, a few key free agents (not going crazy), and team chemistry. IMO, Tortirella will become the Vince Lombardi of hockey if the owners hand out the cash right.
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Old 09-10-2004, 07:21 AM   #7
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Ya but look at all the teams we've seen come and go over the last few years who've either reached the finals and then not made the playoffs or done very poorly the year after: Anaheim, Carolina, Calgary, etc. Teams that spend money, with the obvious exception of NYR, are constantly there and that's where the disparity is. These 1-year Cinderella stories do NOT prove that small-market teams can win because they get lucky 1 year and then are back to losing money for the next five.
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Old 09-10-2004, 06:01 PM   #8
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Perfectly stated lmanchur ...... I enjoy watching thhis one-year Cinderella stories as much as anyone but that's what they become aftera year or so ..... a fairy tale.
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Old 09-14-2004, 03:45 PM   #9
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I don't believe there is anyone in the league today who is truely worth $10 million a season. Todays NHL is so tough that I don't think there is really any single player that truely "dominates" enough to be worth that amount. Looking at durability, speed, toughness, skill, and consistency even if you analyzed the top 20 scorers, none of them have all 5, a few may have 4 of the 5 traits I listed.

The owners may not be 100% truthful about how much they are really losing, but the players are just being plain greedy. I think it was Trevor Linden or someone on the Canucks saying that the last lockout he was a rookie, and that the players in the last lockout make sacrifices so that todays players were taken care of, and that todays players have to fight like the players did last time to make sure that the next generation of players get what they deserve. Thats a bunch of BS. The top 10 players in the league will always get paid what they deserve. But I think alot of players think they are worth more then they really are, and they realize that if a hard salary cap comes, they won't get $7 million a year contracts anymore, only the BEST players will get big contracts, and thats how it should be.
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Old 09-15-2004, 05:33 PM   #10
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I don't see how ANYONE can understand the argument of the players. Which "GIMME THE LOOT YO, I DONT CARE IF EVERYONE ELSE LOSES THE MONEY".

Part of the problem is a lack of understanding on the part of the players.

They want a salary cap under no circumstances, which is absolutely mind boggling. They need a salary cap to play. It is as simple as that. If they come to a fix without a cap, it will simply be a patch on the wound. At least doa soft cap with a harsh tax to teams that go over the cap. AT LEAST, although it is questionable whether or not that will even work.The only solution may be a hard cap.

75% of the revenue goes to players, it needs to be closer to 50% for teams to be financially successful with the amount of revenue that teams bring in.

There needs to be a limit on rookie salaries. If someone gets 4million dollars as a rookie he is going to want that salary to skyrocket if they live up to expectations and teams do not make enough money.

The nhl is not thriving like it was when the current CBA was made. For some reason players think this league is comparable with the NFL, NBA and MLB. The simple fact is that it is not and player's should not get paid like they are part of those other leagues.

Lock 'em out for three years, get in a new class of players that realize lower salary is the only way they're going to play.

This is ridiculous. The players union needs a huge smack.
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Old 09-15-2004, 06:57 PM   #11
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http://www.nhlcbanews.com/news/bog_meeting091504.html

Quote:
We offered the Union systems that would provide an average player salary of $1.3 million, U.S., per season. An average salary of $1.3 million may be less than the players are getting now, but we will not apologize for an average player salary of $1.3 million per season.
I agree with that 100%, the new average salary could be 500,000$ and I wouldn't care. You will not see a single player go on ESPN and say they refuse to play because they can't live off of what they make. They are simply hiding behind the union being greedy, completely ignoring the fans.

I wouldn't take the figures the NHL gives for losses and such as 100% honest, I'm sure those numbers are somewhat distorted.

Quote:
We need a system that will eliminate the disparities in payrolls, so that a team's ability to compete depends on its team-building skills, not on its ability to pay.
Exactly. The players think its about reducing salaries, but its really not. If you score 50 goals every season, you will be a millionaire, the best players will still get payed. Every team needs to have the same amount of payroll to work with to be even. Thats what it's about, even competition.

To me a real salary cap would be saying "a player can only make x amount a year." That isn't whats happening.
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Old 09-15-2004, 07:07 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Doug Graham
The nhl is not thriving like it was when the current CBA was made. For some reason players think this league is comparable with the NFL, NBA and MLB. The simple fact is that it is not and player's should not get paid like they are part of those other leagues.
Your post is good except that the NHL doesn't want a salary cap or luxury tax LIKE football, baseball, and baseball do. It's the OWNERS that want a similar system to those leagues, NOT the players.

I will really get heavy in this disucssion later on but I'm too tired right now to put together much logic
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Old 09-15-2004, 08:02 PM   #13
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I know the player's don't want the salary cap system like those leagues. I could have made that a little more clear in that sentence, but it was said earlier.

What I meant was that players wanted salaries to be like those in other leagues as in they think they are worth as much as a comparable player in a league. So if a mid-tier player is making $1 mill in baseball, a mid-tier hocker player will want $1mill, but that simply can't work.
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Old 09-15-2004, 10:24 PM   #14
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Yup ..... good point Doug. I have no problem with the hockey players wanting to be able to make $20 million a year ..... so long as the league revenues can support.

Problem is, the NHL does not make the money that other professional sports leagues rake in, most notably MLB, the NFL, and the NBA.

As such, the players cannot be expected to haul in similar paydays as their NBA/NFL/MLB counterparts.

As I have also already noted, I have a serious problem with the owners not opening the books to the NHLPA. If they are serious about their claims that 20 of the 30 NHL franchises are losing money, they let the players union see it for themselves. I personally believe that this is the case but until the owners agree to this, it all just looks bad.
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Old 09-15-2004, 10:54 PM   #15
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I think the owners were willing to open the books upon the NHLPA agreeing to certain stipulations or something.

Even though the AMOUNT the owners lost the past couple years is in question, there is no doubt that the league owners have in fact been losing a substantial amount of money.
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