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Old 01-14-2008, 01:48 PM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boston_aloha
I'm gonna SELL this because Pitt was really banged up for this game.

But I do want to point out that I disagree with all the
"Mike Tomlin didn't throw three first-half interceptions"
"Mike Tomlin didn't give up the 96-yard kickoff return to Maurice Jones-Drew."
"Mike Tomlin wasn't on the field to try and contain the late 32-yard scramble by David Garrard that led to the game winning field-goal."

I think you cannot use that for a reason. Players make mistakes - its gonna happen, the coach is there to NOT make mistakes and keep you in the game.
The point being that you could point to a number of variables and plays during the course of the ballgame that hurt the Pittsburgh Steelers -- all of which could be considered just as damaging (or even moreso) than the decision to attempt a 2-pt. conversion.

Mike Tomlin is there to keep his team in the game, and I don't see how anyone who watched that ballgame could say he did anything less than that.
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Old 01-14-2008, 01:50 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by deavobadger View Post
I know his team played hard and did a good job, but he blew the call to go for 2 points from the 12-yard line. I don't argue with going for it from the 2, Tomlin refered to "the chart", it's usually pretty reliable. But you don't go for it on 4th and Goal from the 12 in a similar situation, so don't go for 2 there. Terrible decision that ultimately cost them the game.
I cannot buy the argument that it cost them the game at all. First off, in a game like football it is awfully tough to point to one specific play as costing a team a game. Tomlin is not the one who three picks in the first half to put them down 21-7 at the half.

But, my main argument against your assertion is the fact that the Jags got the ball down to the Steelers 11 yard line with 1:34 left to play. That is plenty of time for Jacksonville to punch it in and take a 35-31 lead as opposed to playing for the field goal that gave them the 31-29 win. The fact of the matter is the Steelers had the lead with 2:38 left in the game and one can just as easily argue that their inability to keep Garrard from scrambling 32 yards on 4th down is what ultimately cost them the game. Tomlin had the Steelers in a position to win the game and defense could not close the deal. One can also just as easily argue that the Steelers win the game if Roethlisberger were not completely inept in the first half.
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Old 01-14-2008, 01:50 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tobynosker View Post
The point being that you could point to a number of variables and plays during the course of the ballgame that hurt the Pittsburgh Steelers -- all of which could be considered just as damaging (or even moreso) than the decision to attempt a 2-pt. conversion.
Sorry Toby - I missed your point completely I think!
I understand what you are getting at now.
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Old 01-14-2008, 02:05 PM   #109
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No coach should ever make a decision that horrendous, and I don't see how you can say it didn't cost them the game, if you watched it. I'm usually for going for 2, but there was too much time left and it was too improbable of a conversion to make.

I'm not saying it's the only reason they lost, there's never one reason any team loses. And you can't argue with the fact that it's a completely different game if they get the extra point. I don't know that they would have won, but they wouldn't have lost the way they did, they would have been in a better position the rest of the game
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Old 01-14-2008, 02:16 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deavobadger View Post
No coach should ever make a decision that horrendous, and I don't see how you can say it didn't cost them the game, if you watched it. I'm usually for going for 2, but there was too much time left and it was too improbable of a conversion to make.
Because, first of all, there is still 10:25 to play in the game. Secondly, again, they had the lead with 2:38 to play and the Jags facing 4th down. The defense's inability to contain Garrard played just a big of role in the loss.

Quote:
I'm not saying it's the only reason they lost, there's never one reason any team loses. And you can't argue with the fact that it's a completely different game if they get the extra point. I don't know that they would have won, but they wouldn't have lost the way they did, they would have been in a better position the rest of the game
I am not debating the wisdom of going for 2. But, ultimately, the bottom line is, they were in position to win the game if they can stop Jacksonville on 4th down. They were in position to win despite the botched two point conversions.

Again, the fact that the Jags only needed a FG changed their approach after the Garrard scramble. Who is to say the Jags don't get the winning TD instead of settling for a FG that would have tied the game at that stage? Even if Tomlin elected to kick the XP there is no guarantee the Jags don't get the TD after Garrard's scramble anyway.

It is just so short sighted to say that one play cost them the game when they had the opportunity to win the game and the defense could not close the deal.
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Old 01-14-2008, 02:33 PM   #111
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SELL...

Mike Tomlin did fine managing the game for Pittsburgh.

He said it himself before they went into the locker-room for the half... "We just need to stop throwing interceptions" ...

Those three interceptions in the first half are what ultimately dug the hole for their fate. Just too big of a defecit to over come.

Sure, that 32 yard run on fourth down by Garrard didn't help, but I've been saying it all year that David Garrard is a play-maker. He makes plays with his feet when he has to, and does more than well at it.

SELL...
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Old 01-14-2008, 02:57 PM   #112
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SELL......

TO's sobbing after the game. TO is about TO, and if Romo is criticized he wouldn't care as long as Romo throws him the ball.
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Old 01-14-2008, 03:05 PM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoonerCenturion View Post
SELL......

TO's sobbing after the game. TO is about TO, and if Romo is criticized he wouldn't care as long as Romo throws him the ball.
Hey Sooner.

Quick pointer... In this thread, you are supposed to "buy or sell" the specific topic at hand. At this time it is concerning Mike Tomlin's play calling during the playoff game.

You can enter a new topic to the list once one of the chosen members says "Next Topic."

No big deal, just trying to keep things organized :thumbup:
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Old 01-14-2008, 03:07 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CKFresh View Post
Hey Sooner.

Quick pointer... In this thread, you are supposed to "buy or sell" the specific topic at hand. At this time it is concerning Mike Tomlin's play calling during the playoff game.

You can enter a new topic to the list once one of the chosen members says "Next Topic."

No big deal, just trying to keep things organized :thumbup:

:thumbdown: my bad
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Old 01-14-2008, 08:04 PM   #115
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So you think it was OK for Tomlin to throw his QB under the bus instead of taking the blame himself?

The 32-yard run would have been much less important if his team is up by 3 instead of 1.

I called it at the time it happened, I remember screaming at the TV,"They're going for it!? This is going to end up costing them the game!"

And at least I think I was right.

Quote:
Those three interceptions in the first half are what ultimately dug the hole for their fate. Just too big of a defecit to over come.
If three first half INT's cost them the game, how did they take the lead in the 4th qtr? It wasn't too much to overcome, because they did.

You can say that Tomlin's decision didn't cost them the game, but it did change the outcome of the game, because the Steelers wouldn't have lost on that FG, it would have required a TD to win, and it is MUCH easier to keep a team out of the endzone as opposed to keeping them from a FG. IMO, an extra point there at least gets them into overtime.
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Old 01-14-2008, 10:23 PM   #116
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The 32-yard run would have been much less important if his team is up by 3 instead of 1.
Uh, how so? It put them on the 11 yard line with over a minute to go. That is plenty of time to put the ball in the end zone. I promise you their playcalling changes if they need a TD as opposed to a FG to win the game there.

Besides, it is not so much how much he gained off of that play as it is that he converted a 4th down to keep the drive alive.

Quote:
If three first half INT's cost them the game, how did they take the lead in the 4th qtr? It wasn't too much to overcome, because they did.
I did not say that they did cost them the game. I said one could make that argument. But, most will agree that it played as big a factor in them losing as the ill-conceived two point conversion did.

Quote:
You can say that Tomlin's decision didn't cost them the game, but it did change the outcome of the game, because the Steelers wouldn't have lost on that FG, it would have required a TD to win, and it is MUCH easier to keep a team out of the endzone as opposed to keeping them from a FG. IMO, an extra point there at least gets them into overtime.
But, that is assuming they keep the Jags out of the end zone and the way that game was going any time Jacksonville needed a big play they got one.
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Old 01-15-2008, 11:28 AM   #117
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Sell. Tomlin's decision making is what led them back to have a chance. The Jaguars made plays to win the game. They didn't simply take advantage of Tomlin's bad calls, they genuinely made plays against good defensive play calling. Tomlin is not fully responsible for the loss. Everybody has to take some responsibility, but I thought Tomlin performed well in his first playoff head coaching experience. I'm sure he'll have more opportunities in the future.
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Old 01-15-2008, 11:33 AM   #118
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It seems that we almost have a consensus here... which means...

NEXT TOPIC
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Old 01-15-2008, 11:37 AM   #119
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TOPIC:

Buy or Sell Tony Dungy coaching the Colts next year.

I am selling. Just like Bill Cowher I think he is burnt out and wants to take some time to recharge his batteries and spend time with his family. He is still young enough that he could come back in a couple of years and take over another team. He probably felt like he owed it to the Colts and his players to come back and make a run at another Super Bowl and that was the only reason he coached this year.
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Old 01-15-2008, 11:49 AM   #120
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I'll Buy it

Dungy is a solid human being, and the NFL could use more men like him. He's a leader, and a helluva coach. Who would the Colts get to replace him? I also feel like Dungy wants to win another one before hanging it up for good.
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