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Old 12-18-2007, 06:53 PM   #1
Brad O.
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Default Pro Bowl teams announced

http://www.nfl.com/probowl/story;jse...o&confirm=true

Noteworthy:

* Dallas has three of the five starting offensive linemen in the NFC.
* Both of the starting NFC DTs play for Minnesota.
* Sean Taylor made it.
* Fred Taylor did not make it.
* Wes Welker did not make it.
* Alan Faneca and Jon Ogden get automatically voted in every year on name recognition.
* So does Champ Bailey.

I don't consider Freddy Taylor's omission a snub. Voting him in this year would have been a lifetime achievement award -- not a good choice. Taylor should have made it in the 1998 season, and you could at least make an argument in 2000, '02, and '03, but this season he's not even the most deserving RB on his own team (Maurice Jones-Drew is), and he's certainly not ahead of Tomlinson, Addai, or Parker.
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Old 12-18-2007, 07:01 PM   #2
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The Bucs got completely screwed. The team that has allowed the second least points doesn't have one defender in the Pro Bowl? I guess the popularity of the Cowboys was just too much.
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Old 12-18-2007, 07:16 PM   #3
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But the Cowboys only have 3 on the defensive side of the ball. Ware is a lock, Hamlin has 5 INT, which is 2nd only to Atogwe of the Rams among NFC safeties, and Newman has 4 INT, and only 3 CB's are ahead of him.

The only person on the Bucs defense that even could make a case for getting snubbed by a Cowboy would be Jermaine Phillips, and hes had no better of a season than Hamlin or Newman, so his case holds no water.

The Cowboys got love mainly on the offensive side of the ball and the ones on defense who got in, have a legit claim to their spots.
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Old 12-18-2007, 07:41 PM   #4
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That proves my point about Phony Homo... Oops, I mean Tony Romo.
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Old 12-18-2007, 08:15 PM   #5
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what point?
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Old 12-18-2007, 10:18 PM   #6
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A little suprised to see Demeco Ryans be the only one of my texans. I thought for sure that Mario would be joining him. Also Welker got jobbed big time. same goes for Joe Thomas in my opinion.
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Old 12-19-2007, 05:22 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by themush View Post
The Bucs got completely screwed. The team that has allowed the second least points doesn't have one defender in the Pro Bowl? I guess the popularity of the Cowboys was just too much.
Agreed. Personally, I voted for three: Ronde Barber, Barrett Ruud, and (sleeper) Jovan Haye.

Tampa's not the only team that got hosed, though. Teams that got no one selected: New York Jets (3-11), Carolina Panthers (6-8), Detroit Lions (6-8), New Orleans Saints (7-7), Tampa Bay Buccaneers (9-5), Jacksonville Jaguars (10-4)

It's hard to argue with not voting for any Jets. But 6-8 is hardly terrible, and you'd think a team that close to .500 would get someone in. Same thing with the 7-7 Saints.

But at least those three (Carolina, Detroit, New Orleans) are kind of understandable. NO ONE from Tampa or Jacksonville? Tampa won its division and Jacksonville may be the AFC's best team outside of New England and Indy.

Meanwhile, four other teams have more than five representatives: New England (14-0), Dallas (12-2), San Diego (9-5), and Minnesota (8-6).

New England? Okay, no problem. Dallas? Seems reasonable. San Diego and Minnesota? Hold on.

9-5 San Diego deserves eight Pro Bowl representatives and 10-4 Jacksonville deserves none? Hell, the Chargers have more people going to Hawaii (8) than the 12-2 Colts (5), and more than the Steelers (9-5) and Browns (9-5) combined (7).

8-6 Minnesota deserves seven Pro Bowl representatives and 9-5 Tampa Bay deserves none? Hell, the Vikings have more people going to Hawaii (8) than the 12-2 Packers (4), and more than all the other team in the NFC Wild Card hunt -- the Giants, Washington, and New Orleans combined (4).

Other things I was wondering:

* Are we really supposed to believe that 4-10 Baltimore deserves three Pro Bowlers?
* I don't particularly like the Giants, but they only got one player chosen to the Pro Bowl (Osi Umenyiora). No Plex Burress. No Shaun O'Hara or Chris Snee on the offensive line. No Michael Strahan. No Fred Robbins or Antonio Pierce or Gibril Wilson. The Giants rank 2nd in the NFC in total defense and lead the NFL in sacks, and Umenyiora is the only one to get credit for that? I'm not buying it. Let's not punish the defense for Eli.
* Seattle got more defensive players chosen than any other team. What's more, they're all starters. But Seattle's defense is good, not great. It ranks 8th in the NFC in total defense, though it's 2nd in points allowed, 2nd in sacks, and tied for 2nd in turnovers. Good? Yes, certainly. Taking worthy spots from Bucs and Giants? Yes, certainly.
* Why do three of the six DTs selected have the last name Williams?

Also, just as a note, no one was taken from the entire NFC South.
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Old 12-19-2007, 10:31 AM   #8
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I'm going on leave again in February (I get to Hawaii Feb 1st) so I think I'm gonna go to this Pro-Bowl...
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Old 12-19-2007, 10:58 AM   #9
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Brad record should have nothing to do with the number of representives. However I do agree that certain teams got shafted. Kellen Winslow not making it in over tony G is a joke. They should basically let the same guys in every year becuase they get in on name alone sometimes it seems.
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Old 12-19-2007, 01:03 PM   #10
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That's one of the most informative posts I have seen in a while. Good work Brad:thumbup:
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Old 12-19-2007, 01:45 PM   #11
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My Personal Pro Bowl Selections:

AFC Offense
QBs - Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger, Peyton Manning
RBs - LaDainian Tomlinson, Ronnie Brown, Joseph Addai
FB - Greg Jones
WRs - Randy Moss, T.J. Houshmandzadeh, Reggie Wayne, Chad Johnson
TEs - Antonio Gates, Kellen Winslow
Ts - Matt Light, Jason Peters, Marcus McNeil
Gs - Alan Faneca, Logan Mankins, Eric Steinbach
Cs - Jeff Saturday, Dan Koppen

AFC Defense
DEs - Mario Williams, Jared Allen, Jason Taylor
DTs - Albert Haynesworth, Tony Brown, Kelly Gregg
OLBs - James Harrison, Mike Vrabel, Shawne Merriman
ILBs - DeMeco Ryans, Ray Lewis
CBs - Leigh Bodden, Antonio Cromartie, Dre' Bly
FS - Ed Reed
SSs - Sean Jones, C.C. Brown

AFC Special Teams
Punter - Mike Scifres
Placekicker - Rob Bironas
Kick Returner - Josh Cribbs
Punt Returner - Roscoe Parrish


NFC Offense
QBs - Brett Favre, Tony Romo, Drew Brees
RBs - Adrian Peterson, Brian Westbrook, Earnest Graham
FB - Mike Sellers
WRs - Terrell Owens, Marques Colston, Larry Fitzgerald, Plaxico Burress
TEs - Jason Witten, Chris Cooley
Ts - Walter Jones, Bryant McKinnie, Jammal Brown
Gs - Steve Hutchinson, Shawn Andrews, Chris Snee
Cs - Andre Gurode, Matt Birk

NFC Defense
DEs - Trent Cole, Osi Umenyiora, Patrick Kerney
DTs - Corey Williams, Shaun Rogers, Kevin Williams
OLBs - Michael Boley, Karlos Dansby, Julian Peterson
ILBs - London Fletcher, Nick Barnett
CBs - Marcus Trufant, Anthony Henry, Charles Woodson
FS - O.J. Atogwe
SSs - Atari Bigby, Jermaine Phillips

NFC Special Teams
Punter - Andy Lee
Placekicker - Nicholas Folk
Kick Returner - Devin Hester
Punt Returner - Tramon Williams
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Old 12-19-2007, 01:52 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boston_aloha View Post
I'm going on leave again in February (I get to Hawaii Feb 1st) so I think I'm gonna go to this Pro-Bowl...
Nice, I hope you have fun man!
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Old 12-19-2007, 02:09 PM   #13
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I agree with Brad mostly.. but here are some of the problems I have with this year's Pro Bowlers.

I know I'll probably get snubbed for this one, but why the hell is David Garrard missing from the Pro Bowl roster?

His team is just as good, if not better than Indy's, and he's one of the big reasons why. I didn't know being the second highest rated passer in the league didn't earn you a trip to Hawaii anymore. That seriously baffles me.

And I know you're going to say, "Well, you can't take anybody out. Brady, Manning, and Roethlisberger are the top three." Well, to be honest with you, even though he had injured receivers, I would take Manning out of this equation and insert David Garrard. Murder me if you must, but that's the way it should be. Hell, you could even replace Big Ben with Garrard.

And another thing. Why the hell is Joseph Addai up there, and not Steady Freddy Taylor? It's sickening how underlooked this guy is. I just can't believe that Joseph Addai can make it, but guys like Fred Taylor and Jamal Lewis get snubbed.

SNUBBED PLAYERS
David Garrard
Fred Taylor
Jamal Lewis
Earnest Graham
Marques Colston
Wes Welker
Nick Barnett
Mario Williams
Darnell Dockett
Ernie Sims
OJ Atogwe
Atari Bigby
Sean Jones

THE "WHY THE HELL AM I ON THE PRO-BOWL ROSTER" LIST
Marion Barber
Joseph Addai
T.J. Houshmandzadeh
Pat Williams
Lance Briggs
Jason Taylor
Lofa Tatupu
Ken Hamlin
Darren Sharper
Bob Sanders
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Old 12-19-2007, 02:29 PM   #14
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Quote:
THE "WHY THE HELL AM I ON THE PRO-BOWL ROSTER" LIST
...
T.J. Houshmandzadeh
What are you talking about? He leads the NFL in receptions(101!!!!), has 11 TDs, and has over 1,000 yards... Aside from Moss, Houshmandzadeh is the most obvious receiver of the bunch.
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Old 12-19-2007, 04:43 PM   #15
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Vandal, I agree with you about Garrard. I think it's very close between him and Big Ben for the last spot, but if I were voting today I would pick Garrard ahead of Roethlisberger. He's been terrific.

I disagree, though, with parts of your snubs/why in list.

SNUBS
------
Fred Taylor - 8th in the AFC in rushing yds, 2nd on his own team in TDs, and absolutely no contribution in the receiving game. He should have been selected 10 years ago, not this season
Nick Barnett - a good choice, but there are lots of good ILBs in the NFC
OJ Atogwe - Atogwe doesn't excite me, but neither do any other NFC safeties, so I won't argue
Atari Bigby - same as Atogwe
Sean Jones - why does everyone seem to love Cleveland's last-ranked defense so much?

THE "WHY THE HELL AM I ON THE PRO-BOWL ROSTER" LIST
--------------
Marion Barber - 7th in NFC in rush yds, 3rd in avg, 3rd in TDs
Joseph Addai - 2nd in AFC in yards from scrimmage, 2nd in TDs. If you're going to complain about an AFC RB, it should be Parker, not Addai.
T.J. Houshmandzadeh - 1st in AFC in receptions, 6th in rec yds, 3rd in rec TDs
Pat Williams - best run-stopping DT in the league
Lance Briggs - 4th among NFC OLBs in solo tackles, has 2 sacks, very good in pass defense
Lofa Tatupu - over 100 tackles and leads all NFC LBs in interceptions and deflected passes
Ken Hamlin - because all the NFC's safeties are mediocre this year
Bob Sanders - because he's been the best safety in the NFL this year and is a very serious DPOY candidate

Quote:
Originally Posted by davematthews3 View Post
Brad record should have nothing to do with the number of representives. However I do agree that certain teams got shafted. Kellen Winslow not making it in over tony G is a joke. They should basically let the same guys in every year becuase they get in on name alone sometimes it seems.
Not directly. Of course not. But it does seem reasonable to think that a team with a better record has more Pro Bowl-quality players on it. For teams like Jacksonville and Tampa Bay to have been so successful this season, but not have any players worthy of Hawaii is almost inconceivable.

I complained about the 4-10 Ravens getting three players in, and you complained about name recognition. Meet Jon Ogden and Ray Lewis. Now the Ravens have a more reasonable one Pro Bowler and you can send truly worthy players instead.

This is less about specific players, though, than about too many close calls going for teams like Baltimore, Minnesota, and San Diego, and too many close calls going against teams like Jacksonville, Tampa, and the Giants. I think it's fair to look at certain teams, especially those that have been successful as a team this season, and say that they got snubbed. Maybe you lose close calls on people like Earnest Graham and Barrett Ruud but win them on someone like Ronde Barber. The problem is when it doesn't seem to balance out, and that disproportionately affects young teams and upstarts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by themush View Post
That's one of the most informative posts I have seen in a while. Good work Brad:thumbup:
Thanks, mush.
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