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Old 06-07-2007, 02:20 PM   #31
da12ken
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CK, does LeBron get along with Brown? James has the clout to get a coach fired, especially if LeBron threatens to leave town. I remember James criticizing the team for not having more of an uptempo offense. It seems like Brown has accodomated that, and LeBron certainly can't complain about Brown's results this year.

Still I'm wondering if coaching might be an issue a few years from now.
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Old 06-07-2007, 02:24 PM   #32
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CK, does LeBron get along with Brown? James has the clout to get a coach fired, especially if LeBron threatens to leave town. I remember James criticizing the team for not having more of an uptempo offense. It seems like Brown has accodomated that, and LeBron certainly can't complain about Brown's results this year.

Still I'm wondering if coaching might be an issue a few years from now.
I'm not sure. All the interviews I've seen with Bron he praises Brown, but that could be BS, public image type of thing. I really can't say. I'm sure if the Cavs lose in the finals, you might hear some grumblings and rumors about the players feelings.

However, as you said, he can't really complain about the results...
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Old 06-07-2007, 06:37 PM   #33
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Avery actually seems like a pretty good coach and that Miami squad wasn't that experienced in the playoff -- at least as a collective unit..
He's ok but he lacks experience. That would be fine if you are coaching the Hawks to 28 wins per year but this guy just got abused by Nellie and Riley in consecutive playoff series.

The Heat did have the 2005 run under their belts. Almost making it to The Finals is some experience...though you are right it was only one year.

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That 2006 Miami squad was a perfect storm. As evident this year, Antoine Walker and Jason Williams are fool's gold. What Riley did with Shaq, Wade and 13 rags we may never see again. Simply one of the greatest coach jobs ever by one of the coaches ever..
I wouldn't call the 13 other guys rags. Experience vs. Youth...give me experience...ALWAYS.

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And I guess Dirk is a superstar. In retrospect that seems open to interpretation though...
I'll agree there. I was refering to the media making Dirk out as a superstar. I personally had him on my 3rd team this year. Putting him on Shaq's level (even when Shaq is 80) would be laughable. Dirk and Nashy are two peas in a pod...destined for great things in cold weather months.


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But back to Avery, I wouldn't be surprised if he joined the Mt. Rushmore of coaches that have won championships over the past 20 years. He's still very young. D'Antoni is also a solid X's and O's guy, but can he handle the pressure of championship play?.
I'd take him over Mike Brown but as long as Pop, Riley, and Jackson roam the sidelines...youth will continue to take their beatings.

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Spurs in 5.

HOF PFs and HOF Cs win rings. Only years one didn't...

2004 Pistons
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Old 06-07-2007, 07:16 PM   #34
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I'd take him over Mike Brown but as long as Pop, Riley, and Jackson roam the sidelines...youth will continue to take their beatings.
I'm not sold on Avery...

I think he's OK but I think he's been given more credit than he's entitled to the last couple years. An A for motivating which I think as a former player, he had the players ear but more a manager to what Nelly left behind also. He's still got a lot to prove especially for what transpired this year in the playoffs...


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Official Prediction:

Spurs in 5.
I'd go with that tho I think the Cavs length & aggressive interior D could possibly push this to 6. For all the accolades they've gotten, the Spurs can get into the paint a lot easier than the Pistons ever could & then you add Duncan. Now we'll see how tough they truly are....
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Old 06-07-2007, 07:32 PM   #35
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I'm not sold on Avery...

I think he's OK but I think he's been given more credit than he's entitled to the last couple years. An A for motivating which I think as a former player, he had the players ear but more a manager to what Nelly left behind also. He's still got a lot to prove especially for what transpired this year in the playoffs...
True...but I'd still take him in a playoff series over Brown. That isn't saying much...I realize that. We're at a point where only 3 active coaches have won a ring (Jackson, Pop, Riley). Combine those guys with the HOF Centers and Power Forwards...can't go wrong...can't go wrong.

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I'd go with that tho I think the Cavs length & aggressive interior D could possibly push this to 6. For all the accolades they've gotten, the Spurs can get into the paint a lot easier than the Pistons ever could & then you add Duncan. Now we'll see how tough they truly are....
The Cavs interior D and their halfcourt D in general should be what they hang their hat on come this series. The only problem is that the Spurs have played like the 1983 Nuggets (ok...maybe not exactly) on the offensive end averaging over 100 PPG against Phoenix and Utah. Yeah, this ain't Utah and sure as hell ain't Phoenix...but shooting is about comfort and routine. The fact that the series starts in San Antonio will give those role players the boost they need to hit the outside shots as Duncan grinds the paint.

The long layoff is another thing to look out for. We'll see if it plays a factor in the outside shooting of the Spurs early on in the 1st half of the 1st game.

The Cavs seem just happy to be here and the city really isn't taking this whole thing that serious. History is just too overwhelming here...Spurs in 5.
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Old 06-07-2007, 07:45 PM   #36
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True...but I'd still take him in a playoff series over Brown. That isn't saying much...I realize that. We're at a point where only 3 active coaches have won a ring (Jackson, Pop, Riley). Combine those guys with the HOF Centers and Power Forwards...can't go wrong...can't go wrong.
As far as Brown & Johnson...Johnson in a heart beat. Brown is in over his head to a great degree. Probably to a point that we see a handful of gaffes that cost the Cavs somewhere along the line...

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The Cavs interior D and their halfcourt D in general should be what they hang their hat on come this series. The only problem is that the Spurs have played like the 1983 Nuggets (ok...maybe not exactly) on the offensive end averaging over 100 PPG against Phoenix and Utah. Yeah, this ain't Utah and sure as hell ain't Phoenix...but shooting is about comfort and routine. The fact that the series starts in San Antonio will give those role players the boost they need to hit the outside shots as Duncan grinds the paint.

The long layoff is another thing to look out for. We'll see if it plays a factor in the outside shooting of the Spurs early on in the 1st half of the 1st game.

The Cavs seem just happy to be here and the city really isn't taking this whole thing that serious. History is just too overwhelming here...Spurs in 5.
Good points...

The only thing I have against the Spurs this year is their tendency to fall asleep at the wheel later in games at times. That's where I put a possible 6 games but I'm leaning towards 5 along with you...
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Old 06-07-2007, 11:46 PM   #37
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Default Game 1: Spurs/Cavs

Kinda like I expected. When the Spurs imposed their Will, it was a mismatch. When the Spurs dozed, it was more competitive...

Maybe this thread for more analysis with the main Finals thread more wide ranging...or, Doublee can combine them...
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Old 06-08-2007, 08:23 AM   #38
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Sorry Tark - I thought I was gonna have time to post on the game 1 thread, then I had issues with trying to get my daughter to go to sleep.....
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Old 06-08-2007, 09:06 AM   #39
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Yeah, the Spurs looked good, but it's only one game.

I didn't realize that the Spurs got so many calls. Is it like that all season? They didn't call s***, in terms of when LeBron would drive. There were at least 5 non-calls that they were definately calling in the series against the Pistons. If the Cavs don't get those calls, they stand no chance. They were able to take away Bron's ability to drive because the refs weren't calling anything.
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Old 06-08-2007, 09:56 AM   #40
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Spurs start quickly with the pick 'n roll using Timmy and Parker for a quick 14 points in the first 6 minutes.

Then they went away from it...even before Vaughn came in to spell Parker?

Cavs can't go under those picks. These ain't the Hawks. Gotta fight and make contact.

Rotation along the perimeter by the Cavs was horrible...esp. in the 2nd half. Sideshow Bob, Gooden, and Marshall need to communicate better cuz leaving Bowen open that many times from the corner (where he likes it) is just unacceptable.

Why do the Cavs insist on setting picks for Lebron? He can get by Bowen. I understand isolation at the top is only viable if the other 4 guys actually move without the ball (not done on a regular basis since 1989) but you can't run 1/2 court pick n roll against the Spurs. That's suicide. San Antonio had 2 to 3 guys waiting for Lebron after he got around his pick.

Overall...about what I expected. We'll see if Brown makes any adjustments. I understand you want the Gibson kid in for O and Hughes in for D but if Boobie ain't gonna put up a high volume of shots and Hughes got a bum wheel...it defeats the whole purpose of having 'em in there. It may be time to put Snow on Parker to defend the pick 'n roll and demand more O from Lebron and Gooden/Iggy (the one who ain't up against Timmy). A little help from Cleveland's bigs from the weakside wouldn't hurt either as Duncan rolls uncontested to the hoop.

Oh yeah...I give Brown until early Game 3 to insert Pollard so he can "politely" show Parker the 5th row on a foul. Time is already running out.

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Old 06-08-2007, 12:48 PM   #41
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I was surprised by the lack of foul calls. I mean, Steve Jabbie was officiating this game! Still, the Spurs D is markedly better and more disciplined than the Pistons. Their arms and footwork are things to behold. The flagrant 1 was borderline too, but this is the state of the NBA.

I was surprised that Brown said in the post-game conference that he wouldn't considering starting Gibson. I'd go with the hot hand.
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Old 06-08-2007, 12:52 PM   #42
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Yeah, the Spurs looked good, but it's only one game.

I didn't realize that the Spurs got so many calls. Is it like that all season? They didn't call s***, in terms of when LeBron would drive. There were at least 5 non-calls that they were definately calling in the series against the Pistons. If the Cavs don't get those calls, they stand no chance. They were able to take away Bron's ability to drive because the refs weren't calling anything.
It's definetely been like that through the playoffs.

I knew it'd be a long night when they called the 1st foul on Gooden to start the game..he was trying to establish the post and Oberto gave a good acting job...got the ticky tack whistle.

It's not just the non calls vs Lebron, it seems like they're afraid to call any foul on Duncan...from blatant hacks to traveling...and Manu gets every flop call he wants along with his Argentine bretheren.

If the Spurs are the better team. which, all in all, I think they are, then why the need to help them with fouls?? Makes a lopsided contest that much more lopsided.

The only real reason for it that I can see is that a lot of money came in on the Cavs +7.5 for game 1. Usually the favorite is the public consensus, but in this case the public hammered the underdog, and whadduya know...Vegas wins again.

I hate the Spurs :thumbdown:
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Old 06-08-2007, 01:00 PM   #43
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Early indications say the rating for game 1 was 7.9. Game 1 of the Spurs-Pistons Finals in 2005 were 8.8.
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Old 06-09-2007, 01:55 AM   #44
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Sorry Tark - I thought I was gonna have time to post on the game 1 thread, then I had issues with trying to get my daughter to go to sleep.....
lol, Sue...N/P

Gotta work on your Sleeper Hold...

The big difference in this series & last is that the Pistons were late in closing off the lane. The Spurs were more than aware of where James was almost all game & were quick to seal off the paint. The fouls themselves were just about even so I don't think that had the impact that the failure of the rest of the Cavs not stepping up did. Actually I think Stern took a page out of the NHL Finals play book by lettin' the boys play....

Agree with Buck on the piss poor defensive rotation, ball movement, movement without the ball, inability to read & react to the S/Rs, gettin' killed on the boards, giving up too many 2nd chance rebounds, etc., etc., etc...

The Cavs have a lot of areas to improve on if they want different results in game 2. The Spurs like to fall asleep at times & get away from success for no apparent reason but the Cavs better not be banking on it. Plus expect the Spurs to shoot better in the next game. This last one should have been a done deal by halftime if the Spurs hit the numerous open looks they blew...

All in all, the Cavs are just up against a quality team that plays tight team D & can score. Personally I just don't see the Cavs solving enough issues to put the Spurs Title hopes in doubt...
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Old 06-09-2007, 10:43 AM   #45
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The Spurs like to fall asleep at times & get away from success for no apparent reason but the Cavs better not be banking on it.
Not in the Finals they don't though. Only the Bulls have a better winning percentage in the Finals than the Spurs do. The Spurs may fall asleep at the wheel at times during the season but when it comes to the Finals they are all about closing teams out.

I doubt this ends up being a sweep but I will also won't be surprised if the Spurs close it out in five or less. To be perfectly honest I think Flip Saunders and the Pistons lost that series as much as the Cavs won it. Why Detroit is even considering bringing Saunders back is beyond me. He is simply re-inforcing the rep he earned in Minnesota as being a coach who cannot get his team to the promised land. I am not even sure he really wants to be there as there were some reports that he would have bolted for the University of Minnesota job this past spring if would have been feasible to do so.
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