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Old 07-14-2005, 09:52 PM   #16
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I said over in another thread that I think this move is intriguing for the Lakers if they decide to play Kwame at the four and shift Odom to his more natural three slot.
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Old 07-14-2005, 11:09 PM   #17
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Kwame MIGHT be decent, probably average 13 points and 8 boards at the most. But i really don't want to see any comparisons to Jermaine O'Neal. Jermaine is/was a lot tougher, a much harder worker, he's got skills to go with his athleticism and strength even though he shoots a pathetic percentage fromt he field for a big man. And I'm sick of people blaming Jordon for turng Kwame into what he is today. I bet if if MJ called O'Neal a soft "phag", O'neal would have been pissed off instead of moping around and O'neal would prove that he's not a phag. Kwame has pretty much lived up to MJ's put downs. Kwame has been a phaggy player so MJ was right. Kwame should have been the better man to say "hey, I'm gunna show you that I'm not a phag," but instead, Brown just took it and went to the corner with his ail between his legs. There hasn't been that much Kwame/O'Neal comparisons here, but the posters at insidehoops, especially the Laker fans are saying that Kwame will breakout like O'Neal did after leaving Portland. And I should be kicking myself just because I post at insidehoops on a regular basis. Well, I guess for every dumbass they have in insidehoops, they need an intelligent poster like me to balance things out.
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Old 07-14-2005, 11:15 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by doublee
I said over in another thread that I think this move is intriguing for the Lakers if they decide to play Kwame at the four and shift Odom to his more natural three slot.
Granted, shifting Odom may be a good thing.. but do you really think Kwame is going to be a good trade for the Lakers, given his history?
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Old 07-14-2005, 11:20 PM   #19
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I've got my Laker DVD that spans the franchise's history up until the last of the 3 titles in 2002. Got old VHS footage dating back to the early 80s of the Lakers. Got a few programs from the 1970s from the first games I went to at The Forum. Even got a few pictures my wife took of me in front of the float of the Lakers from the 1988 Championship Parade when I lived out there. All I need is that statue of Magic in front of Staple and I'm good to go (maybe #99 can thief it for me). Just lock myself up in my room and live out my remaining days. Throw in a Pat Riley poster and a pair of Rambis goggles for luck.

I know those in favor of the new regime will say it takes time. Gotta call 1-800-shrink to ask a pro how long the "rebuilding, rehealing, and reloving" takes if I plan on hanging in here.

I wonder if Jerry West wakes up in the middle of the night crying and yells " WHAT HAVE THEY DONE TO MY BABY!"

We'll all need shrinks by the time this fiasco is over.
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Old 07-14-2005, 11:32 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by buckeyefan78

We'll all need shrinks by the time this fiasco is over.
Actually if Kwame finally lives up to his potential, Odom thrives at the 3, Jackson gets the team focused, Kobe learns how to pass, and a solid point guard signs on,..... IF these all happen, and they're all reasonably possible and even leaning toward likely... then I would say this team would be pretty far from a fiasco. Don't lock yourself in the closet just yet..

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Old 07-14-2005, 11:40 PM   #21
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Back on topic though...

I don't think putting Chucky in the trade is any worse than Devean. Phil does like big point guards ( Chucky's little) and since he is going to truly have to run a real triangle without the spacing created by Shaq, I feel Chucky's contributing days were over. That is if he actually contributed last year.
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Old 07-15-2005, 12:34 AM   #22
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Chucky contributed fuel to the Kobe-bashing fire when he called #8 out in public. On the court...not so much.
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Old 07-15-2005, 07:51 AM   #23
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Quote:
Gotta call 1-800-shrink to ask a pro how long the "rebuilding, rehealing, and reloving" takes if I plan on hanging in here.
You seem to be of the believe that instead of rebuilding, the Lakers should reload and replace. But they don't have the talent to trade for a big name star that can make an immediate impact. With a terrible draft where most are doubting whether or not the only clear-cut number one pick this year will even pan out in the NBA, and a weak year for free agency where some stars are getting overinflated contracts and the Lakers didn't have the spending cash for Zydranus Ilguaskas, Eddy Curry or Samuel Dalembert. Again, I don't have a problem with Kwame Brown being a Laker. I have a problem with Caron Butler and possibly Chucky Atkins not being a Laker.

I guess I can take rebuilding of an organization better than most, having watched the Kansas City Royals General Manager Allard Baird tell Royals fans we have to develop young players, when our former young players like Johnny Damon, Jermaine Dye and Carlos Beltran are contributing to winning ballclubs. But as a fan of American League Central, I have seen rebuilding take time and succeed.

In 1998, the Minnesota Twins unloaded all of their players earning over $1 million, except for pitcher Brad Radke, and rebuilt the whole organization. From 1993 to 2000, the Minnesota Twins posted losing seasons. The Twins swiped Johan Santana, Lew Ford, Cristian Guzman and Kyle Lohse among others when they were young and unproven in the majors. Now, the Twins have won three consecutive American League Central Division Titles. It took time to rebuild.

Granted when compared, the Minnesota Twins probably play in an easier division with the Chicago White Sox being their only competition since their recent success, while the Los Angeles Lakers play in the toughest Conference in the NBA. But, while many disagree with me, the Los Angeles Lakers are still a storied franchise that will be able to lure players into their organization. Given that, plus having an MVP-caliber player in Kobe Bryant, the most successful professional basketball coach over the last fifteen years, and the Lakers have a great starting point. Small-market teams in baseball also have a hard time rebuilding, and their is more parity in the NBA.

The problem is they are trying to go to a quick fix solution, which isn't going to work. If they would have kept this team in tact like it was this season, and they prayed for a little more health and less injury, I believe the Lakers would have been a playoff team. Now, unless they have a trick up their sleeve, they are far from it.

When Phil Jackson was hired, they should have looked at the rebuilding process at least in the terms of three years. Instead, they are looking like they are part of the Extreme Home Makeover construction team trying to put together a winning franchise in less than a week. As of now, this is the most dissapointing move I have seen the Los Angeles Lakers make since the end of the 2004 NBA Finals.

PS. I wrote in a thread a couple of months ago about a USBL point guard with the Kansas Cagerz who had previously worked out for the Los Angeles Lakers last offseason, but was cut in the preseason due to an injury. Nate Johnson bounced back off of that injury well, helping to lead the Cagerz to a second-place finish in the 2005 USBL Postseason Tournament. Johnson, who earned first-team All-USBL honors this season, led the Cagerz during his second-year in the league with a team-high 23 points, 4.23 assists and 1.3 steals per game, while also pulling down three boards a ballgame. He was worked out again with the Lakers, and I wouldn't be surprised to see the 6'2" Guard from Nebraska suit up for the Lakers this preseason. He won't be a superstar by any stretch of the imagination, but have been pretty impressed with what a former Cagerz player in Devon Brown has been able to do with the San Antonio Spurs. Johnson can contribute at that level.

****EDIT: Lakers center Vlade Divac has announced his retirement from the NBA in an exclusive interview with Sportska Centrala, according to NBA.com. Divac, who signed a contract extension with the Lakers last summer, underwent back surgery six months ago and played only 15 games last season, averaging just 2.3 points and 2.1 rebounds.****

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Old 07-15-2005, 08:03 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shawndo
Granted, shifting Odom may be a good thing.. but do you really think Kwame is going to be a good trade for the Lakers, given his history?
I think Phil Jackson could be a wildcard factor here. There are not many coaches who are able to get inside the heads of his players like Phil can. That is as long as he can keep Kobe off of his behind. Kwame really has nowhere to go but up.

Phil will have him over, they will smoke a little hippy lettuce, sing some coombyea, and all will be cool with Kwame. :lol:
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Old 07-15-2005, 11:38 PM   #25
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toby...

My comments were more along the lines of what the Lakers have done sine the end of last year's Finals. Once you trade Shaq and your team is mediocre...AT BEST, you don't go back and forth on your approach. Hire Phil for quick fix? Draft the kid and bring in Kwame a few weeks later? Doesn't make sense. No one says YOU HAVE TO MAKE A MOVE. Sit on your money for another year. Who cares if the Lakers make the playoffs? I definitely don't. The standards are higher than that. Let me know when you are contending again. Kobe is under contract for 6 more years...you have to win AT THE END OF THE CONTRACT, NOT THE BEGINNING TO KEEP YOUR MAIN GUY. The Cavs are the classic example of this. You don't get Redd, Allen, Simmons, so you sign Hughes to a HUGE DEAL? Makes no sense. Sit on the dough, rehire Tractor for peanuts, ditch Iggy, develop your youngins and then next year...BOOM! You break the bank and show Lebron now is the time to win with Amare or Yao.

BTW toby, barring any outrageous circumstances next year, according to your logic (and the world at large), Yao or Amare are coming to Hollywood...right? I'm going to hold you to that. Cap space ain't a problem for L.A. with the new amnesty clause in place. I hope we aren't still in "healing" or "rebuilding" mode and some lame reason develops on why they didn't come here. Good enough for Wilt, Kareem, Shaq, Kobe...good anough for anyone.
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Old 07-16-2005, 04:19 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by doublee
I think Phil Jackson could be a wildcard factor here. There are not many coaches who are able to get inside the heads of his players like Phil can. That is as long as he can keep Kobe off of his behind. Kwame really has nowhere to go but up.

Phil will have him over, they will smoke a little hippy lettuce, sing some coombyea, and all will be cool with Kwame. :lol:
:lol: LOL! that is music to my ears, my friend

I've been reading lots more about it and I'm warming to the idea. I now think it's possible that Kwame could turn over a new leaf if the chemistry is right. I don't see him coming anywhere close to Jermaine O'Neal, but I have changed my mind and now consider this to be a good bet for my Lakers.

Can't wait for next season to start!!!!!!!
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Old 07-16-2005, 04:25 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by buckeyefan78
Who cares if the Lakers make the playoffs? I definitely don't.
Now now buckeye... you and I both know that's not true

You can't be a Laker fan for that long and not care. In fact I think it's the fact that you care so MUCH - that makes you so bitter about the Lakers' recent fortunes (or lack thereof).

This would almost seem contrary to my original dispute with you several years ago about you claiming Laker fan status while not actually supporting the team. But it's not. You can care about what happens to a team without actually being a fan (fanatic) of (for) the team.
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Old 07-16-2005, 04:32 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by tobynosker

****EDIT: Lakers center Vlade Divac has announced his retirement from the NBA in an exclusive interview with Sportska Centrala, according to NBA.com. Divac, who signed a contract extension with the Lakers last summer, underwent back surgery six months ago and played only 15 games last season, averaging just 2.3 points and 2.1 rebounds.****
I was VERY disappointed to hear that. I was looking forward to Vlade's help in the coming season. He is far from athletic, but such a smart basketball player and excellent passer.... and that isn't even his greatest asset.. it's his ability to be the "locker room glue"... to inspire comraderie and team spirit in his teammates. The Lakers could have really used that.

I wonder how much (percentage) of that decision was due to the Kwame Brown trade...
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Old 07-16-2005, 07:07 AM   #29
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Quote:
BTW toby, barring any outrageous circumstances next year, according to your logic (and the world at large), Yao or Amare are coming to Hollywood...right? I'm going to hold you to that.
What logic? The only mention I have ever made about Yao Ming or Amare Stoudemire ever playing for the Los Angeles Lakers was in the thread Honestly, was the O'Neal trade really that bad? All I had said was "Los Angeles is still a major market team with a lot of history that can draw free agents to their organization. While I would be shocked if they did, players like Kwame Brown (free agent this season), or Yao Ming and Amare Stoudemire (both free agents next year) could see great intrigue playing with Bryant and being a piece of the Laker puzzle when things begin to turn around."

If the Phoenix Suns have another season like they did this past year, I don't think Amare Stoudemire would even consider leaving Phoenix. But, I still wouldn't be surprised to hear strong rumors about Yao Ming and the Lakers next off-season. Again, like I said above, I would be schocked if it happened. But knowing the Lakers, I would never rule it out.
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Old 07-16-2005, 10:15 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shawndo
I was VERY disappointed to hear that. I was looking forward to Vlade's help in the coming season. He is far from athletic, but such a smart basketball player and excellent passer.... and that isn't even his greatest asset.. it's his ability to be the "locker room glue"... to inspire comraderie and team spirit in his teammates. The Lakers could have really used that.

I wonder how much (percentage) of that decision was due to the Kwame Brown trade...
But, on the other side of that good for him for doing the right thing. Is there anything sadder than seeing a broken down veteran hanging on just to collect a paycheck or just trying to gravy train for another shot at a a championship? Just like Karl Malone made the right decision this past year not to come back if truly felt he could not make a significant contribution to a team winning a championship. If you ask me, if the Lakers and Phil were smart, they would try and bring Vlade in to coach up guys like Kwame Brown and Andrew Bynum if he were interested in doing so. Vlade may not have been the greatest post player in the league but it can be said he was one of the craftiest and smartest post players in the league and knew all of the tricks of the trade in gaining advantages on his opponents.
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