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Old 07-25-2003, 03:17 PM   #1
MountaineerDave
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Default Millen Fined

I'm not looking to restart the minority hiring policy debate, but I was stunned to see this story. Not much of a story, actually. An announcement.

Still, I was stunned. Interesting to me that it was an individual fine, like a helmet-to-helmet hit would draw, rather than a fine levied at the organization.

Individual fines may be the only way to attempt to enforce these guidelines, but I still believe much must be done to make the guidelines usable, much less enforceable, and I don't like this decision at all. (If this, then Jerry Jones must be similarly fined, as he never officially interviewed anyone but Parcells.)

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Old 07-25-2003, 03:24 PM   #2
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They wanted Steve for the job... and he wanted to go there. End of story.

The best man, no matter his color or race, should ALWAYS get the job.... if it's available. This really wasn't... he was thier man.

This whole P.C thing is kinda getting out of control.
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Old 07-25-2003, 05:00 PM   #3
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My only amendment to your comments, Heathen, is this:

"The best man, no matter his color or race, should ALWAYS get the job... if it's made availabe ESPECIALLY for him."

The Detroit situation stands out as the least disputable case, in my opinion, of a job being cleared for someone else. The timeline is indisputable:
Mooch gets axed.
Millen calls Mooch, says, "Whatchya doin' now? Wanna talk about taking the job up here in Motown?"
Mooch says, "If it's available, I discuss it. Right now, I think I'll work for CBS."
Millen fires Marty. Calls Mooch: "Job's open. My private jet is waiting for you at SFO. See you in a few hours."
Mooch says: "I'll take it, but I want paid. I want input on personnel. Don't need a title. Just the job."
Millen says: "You got it."

Somewhere in there, Millen bothered to field calls or make calls to some minority assistants; probably while Mooch was on the plane to Motown.

The Dallas situation is a better example of not abiding by the guidelines, because Jones knew he was firing Campo in November. Hell, we all knew Jones was firing Campo before the end of training camp. But, a phone discussion with Dennis Green was the length to which Jones went to consider anyone beyond Parcells. That conversation probably went like this:

JJ: "Who would you use at QB?"
DG: "Probably start with Quincy, because I don't think Chad can throw it."
JJ: "So... you gonna work for ESPN next year, or are you looking to hook up with CBS?"

However, the most egregious "working" of the guidelines happened in SF. I won't get into that again. I don't want to have a stroke at work.

I think the guidelines should be set aside for situations like the SF one, where the job becomes available for anyone, whereas the Detroit job only came open because Mooch became available.
SF, Jax, Cincy, and Dallas all had jobs come open to the regular population. Detroit, in my mind, was a special case this season.

Hmm. Detroit had two coaching situations mired in some sort of controversy. That's wierd. I thought that only happened in NY, where there are seven teams with potential for coaching controversy. Detroit only has three teams. (The Tigers simply don't matter, and hence, don't count this year.)

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Old 07-25-2003, 05:42 PM   #4
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Agree that this whole PC thing is getting out of control. Whose to say what you want to do with your team or who you want to interview for coaching jobs? The owners that's who. If I owned a team and someone tried to tell me what to do they would would probably end up with a swift kick in the ass. I guess they could have made the NFL and others happy by wasting other peoples valuable time when they already knew who they wanted and was going to get but I guess they are just impolite like that.
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Old 07-25-2003, 06:33 PM   #5
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The NFL has a pretty lengthy history of telling the owners how they should comport themselves and their businesses. And, look at the NFL now: #1 TV rating sports league, #1 per game attendance in every city, even in hopeless places like Arizona, #1 talked-about sport in nearly every city with a team (possible exceptions are St Louis, Boston, and NYC).

And, by comparison, look at the two leagues with the weakest commissioner's offices, and while baseball dodged a prolonged absence from the field last year, there remains the spectre of a hockey-less 2004-2005.

Meanwhile, Aristides, you've obviously never run a business. There are any number of regulations not regarding hiring by which owners must abide in ANY business.

As I've noted, I thought the Detroit job was the least questionable as far as not abiding by the new guidelines in place. I agree that a prolonged search need not occur when a team knows who they want to hire from the moment the job comes open (by firing or retirement or plain ol' resignation). I've also noted in another thread back in January that I thought SF made a sham of the regulations as they are currently constituted. I'm surprised, in that regard, that the NFL saw fit to fine Millen.

On another note, I think fining the individual decision maker is the right way to go, at least for a time. I think they need shore up the guidelines (unlike other commenters here, I don't see any evidence of a lack of control regarding the institution of reasonable minority job opportunities guidelines/rules) before acting on them, as they did here. I think they need to fix the rules and call them rules before fining people, but in the short-term (and maybe the long-term) I think fining the individual is the way to go.

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Old 07-25-2003, 06:52 PM   #6
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What I'm trying to say Dave is that if I wanted a coach for my NFL team that was clearly the man for the job, then I'm not going to let fines, guidelines, rules or whatever else stop me from getting him which is what every other NFL owner is thinking. Why waste your time and other would be coaches time by having them apply for a job that is already taken? It isn't fair to the job seekers when they could be looking at other oppurtunities with other teams.
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Old 07-25-2003, 07:36 PM   #7
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I think we're in complete agreement, Aristides, on that point. When the job is cleared for someone who wasn't available, and suddenly is....

I think it was Anthony who suggested quite a while back that the NFL should have each organization submit a list of "Dream Coaches" that whose availability would exempt the org. from having to do the fandango that SF fooled everyone with last year.

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Old 07-26-2003, 12:07 AM   #8
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Yeah, I agree that the best candidate for each job should get the job, but it wasn't all that long ago that there wasn't a single black head coach in the NFL and you'll never convince me that the 28 most qualified men to coach in the league were all white.
I'm still not convinced that, in a league in which the vast majority of players are black, that all of the black men qualified to be head coaches are in that position.
Hiring a football coach -- or mostly anything for that matter -- is an exercise in subjectivity; it's up to the discretion of the guy doing the hiring.
And that guy often makes the decision on who he is more comfortable with. Since the guy making the decision is usually white, he tends to be more comfortable with other white people, and this doesn't just go for sports.
Yeah, the best people should get the job. But very often, it's white people who benefit from the affirmative action that comes from decisions made by other white people. And that's coming from a white guy who might have lost a job because of affirmative action (and, 14 years later, I'm still not making as much money as I would have made in my fourth year on the Pittsburgh Police Department, had I gotten that job)
Although the Millen situation is, on its face, a little unfair, it suddenly gives black would-be coaches a little more leverage.
Now, black coaches are going to be able to demand actual consideration for head coaching jobs, rather than submit to a dog-and-pony show that the Detroit interview process would have been.
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Old 07-26-2003, 04:20 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by MountaineerDave
I think we're in complete agreement, Aristides, on that point. When the job is cleared for someone who wasn't available, and suddenly is....

I think it was Anthony who suggested quite a while back that the NFL should have each organization submit a list of "Dream Coaches" that whose availability would exempt the org. from having to do the fandango that SF fooled everyone with last year.

Dave

My specific suggestion was that an exemption from the "guidelines" should be granted in cases where both of the following conditions are present: 1) The team with the head-coaching vacancy finished 6-10 or worse in the most recently concluded season, and, 2) The coach being hired has taken a previous NFL team at least as far as the conference championship round.

In addition to minority hiring, the NFL also has a vested interest in promoting competitive balance, and this policy would be the best way to balance the two interests.
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