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Old 03-11-2007, 01:41 AM   #16
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And, you have completely ignored the most important of my statements -- Responsible gun owners do not need to be controlled and irresponsible ones should not be allowed to own them in the first place.
I have absolutely no problem with reasonable restrictions, but an outright ban is more than I would ever vote for.
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Old 03-11-2007, 01:43 AM   #17
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As to carrying bombs or mustard gas, I have no desire to do so, nor do most reasonable people I know.
As I said, reasonable restrictions must apply.
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Old 03-11-2007, 01:51 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IntheNet View Post
Do you have a copy of Constitution in your basement? The Bill of Rights? Take a look at Second Amendment!

No wait... take a look a First Amendment... free speech... see it? Okay fine...

Want to lose it? Continue your campaign against guns in Second Amendment and you'll lose your right to free speech in First Amendment!
The second amendment has been interpreted to mean individuals have the right to own guns. Other than the fact that seems to ignore the militia purposes which the amendment begins with, it may be interpreted differently at some point. After all, the amendment doesn't specify what type of arms are allowed, yet we restrict what the individual may own.

"Knives, in the hands of someone properly trained are nearly impossible to avoid, and baseball bats are more lethal in close quarters than hand-guns are. A person can disarm someone with a baseball bat and will most certainly inflict damage on a perpetrator."
I'm not sure what you are trying to say with this catman.....I don't think criminals tend to be properly trained in knife fighting techniques The point of using guns in crime, I believe, is that it allows the untrained criminal to have an easily accessable and used lethal threat. It takes a lot more effort to kill with a bat than a gun in general.

I'm not saying I'm against guns and think they should be banned. I'm just pointing out a few parts of your arguments which seemed off.
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Old 03-11-2007, 02:03 AM   #19
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Have you ever seen knife fights in Harlem? Those people can cut someone to ribbons with a minimum of effort. A thrown knife is hard to avoid as you cannot hear it coming.
My point is, was and always will be that it will ne nearly impossible to disarm criminals, as they are already breaking laws to begin with. They won't mind breaking another.
Also, properly trained gun-owners do not need to be controlled. They are law-abiding and take safety very seriously.
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Old 03-11-2007, 03:19 AM   #20
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If guns kill people, then forks and spoons kill fat people that die from being obese, and hospitals are guilty since many people die there too! C'mon, gun control stinks!

The bad stats on gun control is due to bad neighborhoods, and those bad neighborhoods are the key words in this issue!

ENOUGH SAID ALREADY!
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Old 03-11-2007, 12:21 PM   #21
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This seems like a dead horse to me. There are too many arguments for me to address at this time. I guess we will have to agree to disagree. My side has lost this argument and that probably won't change until this country catches up with the rest of the civilized world, probably 50-60 years from now.

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As I said, reasonable restrictions must apply.
What is "reasonable" to me may not be reasonable to you. It is a subjective thing. To me, "reasonable," would mean that no one in this country owns a gun.

Anyway, I think this is a dead issue. I think I need to move to a more forward-thinking, progressive country. The fact that gun control is a BAD thing in this country is very troubling to me. What does this country "know" that Canada, England, France, Spain, Italy, and Germany do not? Those are all less violent countries with less murder per capita. Does that mean nothing? I guess so....
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Old 03-11-2007, 06:13 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by CKFresh View Post
This seems like a dead horse to me. There are too many arguments for me to address at this time. I guess we will have to agree to disagree. My side has lost this argument and that probably won't change until this country catches up with the rest of the civilized world, probably 50-60 years from now.



What is "reasonable" to me may not be reasonable to you. It is a subjective thing. To me, "reasonable," would mean that no one in this country owns a gun.

Anyway, I think this is a dead issue. I think I need to move to a more forward-thinking, progressive country. The fact that gun control is a BAD thing in this country is very troubling to me. What does this country "know" that Canada, England, France, Spain, Italy, and Germany do not? Those are all less violent countries with less murder per capita. Does that mean nothing? I guess so....
Don't like our rights as an American you can always move to one of those less prosperous countries you mention! Nobody is making you stay. It is a free country here isn't it.

Those that you mention are either countries we have already defeated, saved or a country that we are currently protecting! Don't give them so much credit when it isn't due!
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Old 03-12-2007, 10:42 AM   #23
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Quote:
you can always move to one of those less prosperous countries
It depends on how you define "prosperous." If prosperous is financial, then you are right, the US wins. But if you want to talk about peace instead of violence, longer life-expectancy, and quality of life - Canada and the UK are much more prosperous.

I love the US, but when the people in this country look at gun control as a BAD thing, I begin to question the intelligence of our nation. When a man like George W. get's re-elected, it's a bad thing. At least this country is FINALLY realizing what a terrible president he has been. His approval rating is in the negatives and this country has finally realize conservative philophy is failed. Within 50 years hand-guns will be outlawed, so I can be patient!
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Old 03-12-2007, 11:14 AM   #24
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Well Fresh, had the Democrats come up with a reasonable candidate either time Bush ran, they might have won the elections.
As to the intelligence of the nation regarding gun control, perhaps if you would look at reasonable restrictions as good things, you'd be much happier.
Again, responsible gun owners do not need to be controlled.
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Old 03-12-2007, 11:27 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CKFresh View Post
I love the US, but when the people in this country look at gun control as a BAD thing, I begin to question the intelligence of our nation.
I see it as just the reverse; American judges can recognize when denying citizens of the District of Columbia their due civil rights was illegal and reverse the policy!

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At least this country is FINALLY realizing what a terrible president he has been.
Lame duck president in last quarter of his presdiency.... Abraham Lincoln's ratings were in single digits in 1864 and he didn't do so bad!

Quote:
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Within 50 years hand-guns will be outlawed, so I can be patient!
Perhaps we'll just outlaw liberals! Much easier!
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Old 03-12-2007, 11:52 AM   #26
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Quote:
Perhaps we'll just outlaw liberals! Much easier!
Once again, showing your lack of objectivity and you lack of respect for a diversity of opinions. I would never suggest that we censor conservatives or outlaw them. I think the thing that makes this country so great is diversity and the right to voice your opinion. You, on the other hand, think deadly weapons make this country great, hmm......
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Old 03-12-2007, 12:14 PM   #27
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Fresh, I really doubt if you'll ever see hand-guns banned in this country. Even if there are laws in place to make it illegal to sell them, they will still be around.
There are many legitimate uses for hand-guns. Courriers use them. Law enforcement personnel use them. Many people guarding factories and shopping areas carry them. Then there are the hunters that use hand-guns for hunting small game -- rabbits, squirrels, small birds.
I will not change your mind, but do not question the intelligence of the nation simply because the majority disagrees with you.
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Old 03-12-2007, 12:44 PM   #28
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Quote:
I will not change your mind, but do not question the intelligence of the nation simply because the majority disagrees with you.
Fair enough. You are right. I apologize for insulting anyone here. I guess we just see this issue differently. I think the only way to work towards a solution will be compromise, and catman has at least started to appeal to that idea. The problem is on both sides. People like me are not happy unless all guns are banned. Those on the other extreme want the right to own any type of weapon they chose. There must some middle ground. I know we do background checks now before one can purchase a gun, but maybe we should start tracking these guns better, to make sure guns that are purchased legally do't get sold on the black market. Likewise, would you fellas support tougher punishments for anyone who commits a crime with a gun?
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Old 03-12-2007, 12:56 PM   #29
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I have no problem enforcing the laws currently on the books, Fresh. All I am saying is that we do not need more laws for criminals to disregard.
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Old 03-12-2007, 12:57 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CKFresh View Post
People like me are not happy unless all guns are banned.
Have you ever gone to range and shot a gun? Perhaps read some of the monthly stories about people that use guns to stop crime? Every been hunting?

Not saying you have to do any of these things; but you might consider them....
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