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Old 02-13-2003, 01:03 PM   #1
buckeyefan78
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Default Cowher gets jury duty...esp. for Dave.

Last night on KDKA news at 11, they reported that our old buddy Bill Cowher got jury duty !

Appearently, the case involves a pizza delievery guy who got shot, obviously somewhere here in Allegheny County.

Sources inside the courtroom, ( yeah, they followed him in there even ) say Cowher is showing the same " intensity" on this case that he does on the field. Proably that look on his face when Kordell throws a pick :redhot:

My question is this. How can they trust Cowher with making a decision about a man's life, when he can't even judge properly that Kordell has sucked all these years? ...LOL

Oh well, thought you guys, and especially Dave, would get a kick out of this one.

Last edited by buckeyefan78; 02-14-2003 at 12:49 AM.
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Old 02-13-2003, 01:27 PM   #2
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LOL....good stuff Buckeye! Cower's judgement is somewhat scattered, and can you imagine getting on the stand and having Cowher stare you down with one of those looks....in which those who get on the stand may not have ever seen that look before. Who needs a defense lawyer, when you have Cower as part of the jury?

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Old 02-13-2003, 06:27 PM   #3
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Ouch. Look, I know there are some Steelers fans here, but I think we're getting way too hard on Cowher.

In his first six years as head coach, the Steelers went 64-32 with 6 playoff appearances and 5 division titles. They went 5-6 in the playoffs, including a Super Bowl appearance. This despite consistently losing their best free agents and coaching assistants. How many teams could lose Kevin Greene, Dom Capers, Rod Woodson, and Chan Gailey and keep winning?

In the late 90's Cowher had his only two losing seasons, lost Carnell Lake, Greg Lloyd, and Yancey Thigpen, but rebounded to win the last AFC Central title and advance to the AFC Championship Game. Cowher's regular season winning percentage is .622, significantly better than Chuck Noll's (.566). Take a step back, think about all of that, and tell me there's a more accomplished coach who was active last season.

===

The main criticism I've read centers on Cowher's playoff performance. The Steelers have been to four AFC Championship Games under Cowher, going 1-3. No active coach other than Dan Reeves has been to that many conference Championship Games, and Reeves has had an extra decade to do it.

In '94, fine, the Steelers were unprepared after they pasted the Browns 29-9 in the Divisionals. In 1995 they faced a streaking Colts team and won, although I do think they choked in the Super Bowl against a beatable Cowboys team. Still like that onside kick call, though. I wonder how much they were just missing a leader on the field (*ahem*, Neil O'Donnell) to capitalize on the momentum that picked up.

In 1997 Pittsburgh lost by 3 to the Broncos team that upset Green Bay in the Super Bowl. I wouldn't call that a choke by any means; Denver was the better team. Last trip was 2001, and I know the Steelers were favored, but by that point in the season, New England was the best team in the NFL. Blame the special teams coaches and players if you must, or blame Kordell and Bettis, but last year wasn't Cowher's fault.

I've read a lot of criticism of Kordell -- what if he went to Cincinnati, btw? -- and I wouldn't imagine O'Donnell is terribly popular, either. Wouldn't it make just as much sense to blame Pittsburgh's personnel as it would to blame Cowher's coaching? I'm not saying the guy is the new Lombardi or anything, but I don't understand the ferocity of the Cowher-bashing.

===

Active Coaches with the most Postseason Experience

Bill Cowher.........7-8
Mike Holmgren....9-6
Bill Parcells........11-6
Dan Reeves.......10-9
Schottenheimer..5-11
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Old 02-13-2003, 07:34 PM   #4
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I think you're off here on Cowher Brad and I'll see if I can't help out the situation before Dave reads your post and has a nervous breakdown.

Ok, you mention Cowher is 1-3 in AFC Title Games Brad. That is correct. What you failed to mention is how ALL 4 games were in Pittsburgh.

vs. San Diego...Cowher's first AFC Title Game. Steelers come out flat and COMPLETELY unprepared and lose while being HEAVY favorites. First sign of Cowher's inability to win a big game. Isn't it the coaches job to prepare?....hmmmm...just wondering

vs. Indy...you refered to them as "streaking" Brad. Colts must have borrowed some Irish luck from Notre Dame this year, cause this team was not very good at all. 9-7 in the regular season and after Harbaugh's pass fell incomplete in the endzone, the Colts fall off of the map until Peyton Manning shows up years later. This Colts team was a fluke, and Cowher barely got his boys passed them only to have O'Donnell play like a little girl ( Cowher's inability to recognize what kind of qb it takes to win the " BIG ONE" becomes evident here )

vs. Denver... not as much shame in this one Brad, I'll give you that. Broncos had a champion in Elway, but still, game was at Three Rivers and the Steelers had their chances.

vs. New England... special teams flop of epic proportions and once again Kordell melts under the pressure. Cowher's inability to understand what kind of qb it takes to win the " BIG ONE" is illustrated beautifully once again. Kordell should have been in Canada years earlier,but Cowher is an idiot.

Next topic to tackle Brad...Cowher's 5 division titles in 6 years. Looks impressive, don't it? But, let's take a deeper look. Who is in the Steelers division in this time frame? Cincy ( who haven't had a pulse since 1990), Cleveland ( who were down after their last lost to Denver in the 89 AFC Title Game and only fielded one good team in that span- 1994, which Pitt beat 3 times and then moved to Baltimore), and Houston ( who were good in the early 90s, but became inconsistant). Wow, that's some good competition for the Steelers....that is....if they were playing in a pee wee league. The 4 team AFC Central during this time frame was terrible.

Your point of the Steelers ability to reload with players and coaches is also a little thin Brad. Name me one Steeler who has had as much success AFTER leaving Pittsburgh? Hell, name me one Steeler who has had " decent " success after they left the Steel City? Thigpen...mmmm....Greene....mmmm...? Come on, these guys aren't earth shattering players. The Steelers success has been due to their coordinators and their systems. Mike Mularkey, who I have no idea how much respect he gets outside of Pittsburgh, has one hell of an offensive mind, but he is stuck with Cowher's brain dead way of coaching.

As for Dan Reeves, he's a bum too. :redhot: I HATED him when he was with my Broncos. His constant bumbling in his game plans FORCED Elway to be the comeback king. Dan Reeves owes his first born son to Elway,as many times as Johnny bailed him out.

As far as putting Cowher in the same sentence as Noll, I can't phathom the words to describe how rediculous that is.

Noll spent his first years in the league building the Steelers into the power of the 70s ( see, coaches had to build teams and actually coach players back then ). If Cowher was in a " building" era instead of a free agent era, I would grant him some leniency, but it's not to be. Noll also got 4 rings when it was all said and done, while Cowher got a box of tissues for Kordell

Cowher's had enough time to win. He's a bum with no idea what a big game qb is. His coordinators and his owner have helped make his sorry ass look respetable to a certain degree all these years.

Now, stand back and watch Dave blow once he reads these posts.....
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Old 02-13-2003, 08:38 PM   #5
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Alright. I've kind of burned myself on the SF-hires-Erickson-turned-47-vs-Dave-race-debate of the decade.

I have to say, 78, that the first line of your post made me laugh so hard I'm still finding crumbs of the food I had in my mouth lying around. Pretty gross, actually.

I can't agree with you more on anything, 78.
By the way, didn't the Steelers have a lead against the Broncos, and Kordell did the amazing shrinking QB dance, throwing picks to be sure he wouldn't have to go be a Super Bowl QB? I was at work that day, and I don't remember the specifics of the game. I'm pretty sure Kordell lost the game though.

On Neil O'Donnell: While Kordell's popularity seems to have increased with time, O'Donnell had several minuses put against him. The second interception to Larry Brown on what was to be the game winning drive is, of course, the biggest. But, his willingness to leave town for the cash, besides just being an ass in general and on TV all counted against him in the end. He couldn't return to Pittsburgh after the Super Bowl. Fans would have dogged him incessantly for taking a dive.

I don't know if the sentiment in the 'Burgh is still as prevalent as it once was, 78, but I knew a ton of people, and way down in a place I try not to reveal, believe that O'Donnell threw that pass to Brown deliberately.

Cowher's coaching ineptitudes have been disguised by having great assistants--Marvin Lewis, Dick LeBeau, Jim Haslett, Chan Gailey have all moved on to head coaching jobs; Ron Earhardt was highly regarded, if he started to lose it toward the end of his career--and Tom Donohoe. Donohoe knew when to put the money on the table for players, and when the young talent was ready to move up. I was a Cowher devotee while I was in Pittsburgh, but having been away awhile, getting a fresh perspective on his record, I think, Brad, that the numbers just don't make the case anymore. In today's NFL, an 11-year coach should have reached the Super Bowl, plain and simple. At the very least, they should have shown up for at least one of those AFC Championship games.

Cowher has very much become more Chin than Win. Yes, he's a great regular season coach, but since when did we stop judging greatness by the ring on fingers. He has one AFC title in 11 years. ONE! He should have lost three Super Bowls by now, but doesn't know how to prepare the team for the games that matter.

I return to this season's beginning: Jawing by Steelers indicated that they would show up agains the Pats in the year's first Monday Night game of the year. They did, and Kordell happily picked up where he left off in the previous year's AFC title game, going on to throw 4 INTs to the Patriots defense in 5 attempts.
The rest of the team did its share of choking, too. The coaches seemed completely unprepared for the Pats spread offense. Worse, the team was unprepared for a similar offensive gameplan from the Raiders just 6 days later. WHAT?!! They didn't address tackling and pass defense after getting shellacked by the Pats. OY and Double OY.

In my mind, I think he has to win this year, or be hired by Arizona next year. Reality requires that some provisos be attached to that, but, I think time should be up.

Oh, I just have to say this, Brad. Who would you blame for last year's flat performance against the Patriots? Bill Cowher is the cause of the debacle. The Patriots hit the Steelers, and then they hit them again and again. The Steelers backed down and crawled away. Everyone in that stadium that afternoon knew as I knew watching on TV: Cowher didn't get the team ready, and with the game on the line, there isn't one guy I'd rather NOT have on my team than Kordell. I mean that.

Kordell to Cincy won't happen because I think the Bengals are sticking with Kitna.
Kordell wants to go to Miami, which I think would be a weird fit. Kordell, king of choking in games that matter, with backup Fiedler, the only guy currently in Kordell's ballpark as far as choking and inconsistency goes. Yuck. If the Dolphins were to sign Kordell, as Wayne Huizenga I'd start firing people as soon as the ink dried and I wouldn't stop until only Ricky Williams, Chris Chamber, Patrick Surtain, and Jason Taylor were left.

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Old 02-13-2003, 09:29 PM   #6
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Wow, 78, a point-by-point refutation of my post.

First of all, I partially agree, especially with a lot of what Dave wrote. Are we all agreed that Cowher's a good regular-season coach?

78, on the AFC CG's. Maybe I didn't make it clear in my original post, but I agree with you about the 94 game. They blew it, and it's right to blame Cowher for not having his team prepared.

In 95, the Colts were definitely streaking. They blasted the Chargers by two touchdowns on the road in the wild card game, then went to Arrowhead Stadium (remember when that was hard?) and knocked off the 13-3 Chiefs, top seed in the AFC.

97, it sounds like we basically agree on. I don't care if the game was in Cowher's back yard, Denver was the better team. You don't blame the head coach for losing that one.

And last year, I flatly think the Patriots were the better team. Pittsburgh blew it on special teams. I don't know how much of that was Cowher's fault, but it would be absurd to lay all the blame on him. Kordell had a crappy game. The team made a terrible decision when they game him that long-term deal after, what was it, 1998? Cowher's had his hands tied ever since -- basically forced to stick with the guy or hope one of his backups turned out to be a hidden gem. I don't blame Cowher for last year and I don't know who is responsible for the stupid Stewart signing, but it certainly wouldn't be fair to put all the blame on the head coach.

The point about the AFC Central's weakness is a good one, but 5 division titles in 6 years (or 7 in 10, for that matter) is impressive no matter who is in the division. Pittsburgh actually went 34-22 out of division during those six years, never worse than 5-3. And non-division games are the ones weighted for difficulty, so the Steelers presumably were playing good teams from other divisions, even.

And I actually wasn't trying to make a point about the Steelers' ability to re-load. I was trying to say that Cowher's done a lot with a little. His team consistently lost its best players in free agency, and the best coaches got hired away by other teams. Greene, Woodson, and Lake have all been successful even since they left Pittsburgh. Especially Woodson. If they hadn't been, though, what would that indicate? That decent guys were impact players when they were playing for Cowher? Maybe I missed your point.

And you can make an argument against a guy without turning him into the worst coach ever. Surely Cowher deserves a little credit. Hasn't he consistently assembled a fantastic coaching staff? btw, Mularkey does get national recognition.

Quote:
As far as putting Cowher in the same sentence as Noll, I can't phathom the words to describe how rediculous that is.
That's very fair, but I didn't mean to imply that Cowher's as good as Noll. He isn't, hasn't been, and never will be. I was just comparing the records and trying to put Cowher's in perspective. Just to point it out, though, Noll went 78-76 over his last 10 seasons. His legacy was established in the 70's -- Noll was nothing special in the 80's.

Quote:
In today's NFL, an 11-year coach should have reached the Super Bowl, plain and simple.
Dave, this is the one point I most agree with. I'm a little confused since Cowher has reached the Super Bowl, but your general point -- that Cowher hasn't converted his regular season success into postseason progress -- is a good one. I still think he's a good coach and I wouldn't give up on him yet.
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Old 02-14-2003, 12:45 AM   #7
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I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one Brad. Yeah, I had to make point by point rebuttle, I'm still trying to get my head out of the water after making that Favre-55 td's -a -year remark....remember...LOL...

Okay, I will admit *sighs a little, and squirms uncomfortably*, that Cowher has a good regular season record. But like Dave said and you agreed with Brad...11 years...and no ring...nothing can hide that...it's like a big zit on a teenage kid's face on prom night.

On the loss of players and coaches. What I am saying here is the Steeler coaching staff ( namely Mularkey and Gailey, who I like the best) have devised plans that best suit the talent. I can't think of a more cohesive team with schemes suited to their talent, especially on defense, then the Steelers have been over the past decade.

What really drives this point home is the fact that for the most part (excluding this year when their passing game opened up and Mularkey was given more room to be creative) Steelers games are EXTREMELY BORING to the average fan. ( sorry Pittsburgh faithfull ) The Sportscenter generation doesn't care about the Steelers unique 3-4 defense, the historically power running game, and the overall slow paced, low scoring offense.

I can say this, if there is a team in this league who IS MORE DEFINED BY THEIR CORDINATORS APPROACH AND SYSTEMS, I haven't seen it.

I COMPLETELY DISAGREE with you Brad on the Steelers-Pats game. The Steelers were clearly the better team coming into that game and for the entire season as a whole. Cowher's big game choking bit them in the ass there. One question for you....where was the Steelers power running game? They had no Bettis, and they said to hell with it. The Steelers got beat in the trenches, and that's where it counts. The o-line played like school girls and Cowher's desperate hope in Kordell ran thin and failed as Stewart threw balls to everyone except his teamates. The game was close, and Cowher got tight and so did Stewart ( which happens all the time ). Add the special teams disaster and you've got another choking on your hands. UNPREPARED MEETS THE PREPARED...ONCE AGAIN.

In all fairness to you Brad ( but not to Cowher, cause he's a bum ), some of the blame has to go to the players,staff, and those who make other decisions. But the question is this...if the entire Steelers organization, despite what flaws they may have, have given Cowher the players, coaches, support, and everything else to be so competitive over the years, don't you think even a " decent" coach could overcome the final hurdles to take what has been an obviously very strong team to atleast one title ? Especially since the AFC was very weak until Denver came up in 97.

And with that, I send Cowher off to Chokerville....ADIOS BILLY
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Old 02-14-2003, 01:50 AM   #8
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To Dave...I've never heard anything about the O'Donnell Conspiracy you described here in Pittsburgh. And yes, Kordell threw an int in the endzone against Denver in the AFC Title Game, and the Black and Gold lost by 3. As a Bronco fan, I remember thinking, " damn, thank God Kordell blew it"...LOL.

That resigning of Kordell was either 98 or 99, I'm sure Dave knows for sure Brad. Either way, don't you think they asked King Cowher if he wanted Mr. Stewart back?...I think it was ATLEAST taken into consideration.

Point to Brad for Noll not special in the 80s. Man was that a bad era for that team.
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Old 02-14-2003, 02:16 AM   #9
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I hope Cowher chokes in the jury decision. 11-0 against somebody and Cowher is the dissenting voice just because he wants the free room.

Either that or he's running a 3-4 defense with 4-3 personel and confusing the hell out of everyone in the room.
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Old 02-14-2003, 11:23 AM   #10
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I will cite another poor coaching decision by Cowher...starting Bettis in the AFC title game against the Pats. Bettis didn't even gain a yard, and if they had started Amos Zeroue they would have had much better success on the ground. Finally, they started to implement Amos in the 2nd half, where they had a long sustained drive of over 70 yards and touchdown....with Amos running the ball in for a td. At least Cowher let Amos take over the reigns this season at the tailback position.

The Steelers, to me at least, were the better team over the Pats.....but with that being said the Steelers were "Out Coached" and were beat by a team who had more "Heart" that day.

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Old 02-14-2003, 11:49 AM   #11
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Starting Bettis was a big mistake, agreed Joey. That was partly Cowher's fault and partly Bettis' fault too. He got a cortizone shot before the game and it messed him up big time. Now, I put some blame on Bettis for MAYBE not telling Cowher how jacked up he was, but I also blame Cowher for not being able to read his players here. Bettis is a competitor, he wants in. There's guys in this league who would tell their coach..." yeah, I'm fine, good to go coach" even if some one had just dropped a safe on their head.

Again, put some blame on Bettis for wanting in, when he wasn't ready, but not to much in my opinion. It was game time, the juices are flowing, " IT'S ME AGAINST THE WORLD" mental state is on....so Bettis gets a little slack here from me, but not Billy boy.

Cowher SHOULD have been able to read the situation better. In fact, it was later revealed in the offseason, that even before the cortizone shot, Bettis was still in pretty bad shape, and Cowher knew this !!!! So, Bettis is still not close to 100% and Cowher knows this. And then Bettis gets a cortizone shot that numbs him, and Cowher knows this too. So what does Cowher do? He starts Bettis....what an IDIOT !

Cowher's inability to read Bettis here is common for this bum. His inability to understand and deal with Kordell's limits over the years have been proven over and over again.
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Old 02-14-2003, 05:21 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by buckeyefan78
I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one Brad. Yeah, I had to make point by point rebuttle, I'm still trying to get my head out of the water after making that Favre-55 td's -a -year remark....remember...LOL...
LOL, yeah, I remember. I actually meant it as sort of a backhanded compliment, because I think your posts are consistently some of the best on the boards. So compared to your usual insights, it was the "wrongest" thing you've posted here.

I see your point on the coordinators -- and I agree -- but doesn't Cowher deserve some recognition for finding so many excellent assistants? With the possible exceptions of Mike Holmgren or Dennis Green, I doubt any coach in the 90's did such a good job of assembling coaching staffs.

I'm willing to agree to disagree on the Patriots game.

Quote:
Originally posted by buckeyefan78
But the question is this...if the entire Steelers organization, despite what flaws they may have, have given Cowher the players, coaches, support, and everything else to be so competitive over the years, don't you think even a " decent" coach could overcome the final hurdles to take what has been an obviously very strong team to atleast one title ? Especially since the AFC was very weak until Denver came up in 97.

And with that, I send Cowher off to Chokerville....ADIOS BILLY
I partially agree, and again, I'm not trying to turn Bill Cowher into Vince Lombardi here. BUT (you knew there was a "but"), here's a list of coaches who have had at least eleven consecutive seasons without a league title (Super Bowl, or NFL/AFL championship before that):

Hall of Famers: George Allen, Paul Brown, Bud Grant, George Halas, Tom Landry, Marv Levy, Chuck Noll, Steve Owen, Don Shula
others: 15 besides Cowher, including Don Coryell, Chuck Knox, Buddy Parker, and George Wilson

Halas and Landry are the only ones who went on to win the big one after the drought, but that's still pretty elite company. Cowher has proven himself to be a good coach. 7-8 in the postseason is... about average, isn't it?
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Old 02-14-2003, 10:57 PM   #13
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Lol....Yeah, I know Brad. I liked how you called it my " wrongest" comment ever though. I was carried away in the moment, and I'm like a five year old when I watch Favre play, I think he can throw the ball to the moon....LOL... , which is a good thing when you think about it.

Ok, back on topic. I concede that Cowher must have good ability in choice of assistants. You got me there. His list is impressive, but you also brought up Holmgren as an assistant hiring master too, which brings up a good point. Good old Mr. Holmgren has had the likes of Reid, Mooch, and Shannahan to name a few help him in making the Packers a title contender and even a WINNER.

But, Holmgren's " super assistants" are now all gone, and where does that leave him?...why in the gutter of course. Sporting a 31-33 record with, admittingly, a not very good Seattle team. Where's his magic now? Well, you wave that same magic wand over Cowher and take away all his " super assistants" like Gailey and Mularkey, and I think you'd see Cowher exposed as the fraud he is.

You listed the coaches that went 11 consecutive years without a league title Brad, to show how even the best of the best have shared Cowher's plight. Good point again, but not as strong as it may look at first glance.

First let's list the coaches you mentioned below with the years they won the league title...
Paul Brown...Cleveland ( 1950,54,55)
Steve Owen... NY Giants (1934,38)
George Wilson... Detroit (1957)
George Halas...Chicago (1933,40,41,43,46,63)
Don Shula...Miami (1973,74)
Tom Landry...Dallas (1972,78)
Chuck Noll...Pittsburgh (1975,76,79,80)

Okay, so these coaches AT SOME POINT in their careers went 11 years without a league title, but notice all those titles they won outside of the mandatory 11 year period to match Cowher. It comes to 20 league titles to Billy's big fat 0 ! :uhoh: Throwing out names like Paul Brown and George Halas is absurd Brad. Yeah they may have went through an 11 year span without a title, but WITHOUT THESE TWO MEN THE BUILDING IN CANTON WOULD FEEL AS EMPTY AS COWHER'S CHAMPIONSHIP TROPHY CASE !! More than coaches, these guys are VERY responsible for the success of the NFL today.

Moving to the modern era of the above coaches of Shula, Landry, and Noll, all I can say is this. They won a title sometime with their team, and that is good enough to beat out Billy Cowher. Now, if your saying Noll, Landry, and Shula stayed a bit longer then maybe they should have, I would agree there, but without these guys ...Miami, Pittsburgh, and Dallas would be in a class with the Houston Texans !!!! They overstayed yes, but I would sacrifice a coach holding on a bit to long to give me what thesed guys gave to their fans in the 70s, TITLES !

As for the others, real quick points here. George Allen...ok, never won a ring, but took Skins to 7 consecutive winning seasons when they had only 1 in previous 15 years ! Plus, he never coached the same team over an 11 year span as Billy has.

You got me on Coryell, Bud Grant, and Marv Levy. If you want to put them in with Cowher, go ahead. In all fairness, Levy and Grant lost 8 Super Bowls combined, and out of the 8, I believe only once was their team atleast even with their opponent ( Bills-Giants Super Bowl). Still not much of an excuse here, but if you want to put them down as bums with Cowher, go ahead.

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Old 02-15-2003, 06:11 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by buckeyefan78
Throwing out names like Paul Brown and George Halas is absurd Brad. Yeah they may have went through an 11 year span without a title, but WITHOUT THESE TWO MEN THE BUILDING IN CANTON WOULD FEEL AS EMPTY AS COWHER'S CHAMPIONSHIP TROPHY CASE !!
That may be my favorite quote ever from the SCMB. I laughed out loud at that one.

And regarding the great coaches whom I mentioned with Cowher, point conceded. Guys like Halas, Brown, Shula, Landry, and Noll clearly belong in a different class.

I guess my only point all along -- and I went overboard in trying to prove it -- has been that Cowher wasn't getting enough credit in this arena. We've both made painful concessions now, and I think we've arrived at or near a consensus: Cowher's a fine regular season coach -- one of the best in the league today -- but he hasn't proven he can translate that to success in the playoffs. Until he does, he's merely a good coach -- not a great one, and nowhere near the legendary status of Halas, etc.
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Old 02-15-2003, 05:41 PM   #15
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I agree with you Brad on Cowher being a good regular season coach. And I see your points and agree we've made concessions. Good debate...

While reading my above posts, I've noticed some deep seeded anger towards him...:redhot: ...LOL. And he isn't even the coach of my team!

The thing is, I feel like he is a choker and someone who gets so tight during the big game, you'd think his life was on the line. I put Kordell with him on this topic too, as a choker. I CANNOT STAND choking, and that's proably where this comes from. As a Ohio St. fan, I become so intolerant to choking under the John Cooper era and all the failures against Michigan, that it's damaged me for life.LOL...

Now we can put this one to rest Brad... and maybe I can save some of my sanity...LOL... Hey, you try having John Cooper coach your team for nearly a dozen years !!!!
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