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View Poll Results: Who will win the Championship
Mavericks 4 26.67%
Heat 11 73.33%
Voters: 15. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-21-2006, 11:07 PM   #151
Shawndo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckeyefan78
Let me gather my bearings Shawn. I'm going to set up a point by point thread in the near future for you and toby complete with Q&A to try and help you guys see the light.

My back hurts from carrying the legend of Bob Pettit all these years. When I'm dead, someone is going to have know something to pass on.
Sure thing man.... if you can mount an argument that a Shaq-led Lakers team in '06, minus Kobe, would have been a Title contender.... I'm all ears.
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Old 06-22-2006, 12:47 AM   #152
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Congrats to the heat. I don't like many of the players on there team but Alonzo Mourning winning the title brought me to tears last night. What a couragous man.
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Old 06-22-2006, 03:37 AM   #153
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Regarding all the ratings talk...

I tuned in for most of this series cuz I love watching Wade play and the Mavs' general style... plus I might get to hear Avery Johnson yelling (always a highlight). But the awful, terrible refereeing will probably keep me from watching again for a long time (and I was cheering for the Heat). If others are like me, this was a baby spike before a waterfall

[by the way guys, any way you could edit down those mega-posts... i really don't have the attention span for this]
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Old 06-22-2006, 10:27 AM   #154
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I apologize to Billy, to Shawn and to all of the readers on the NBA board for keeping this going, but things do need to be straightened out a bit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
Diving in with an assumption than an out & out question made your post very confusing
Let's first begin by pointing out that you made the initial assumption before my post that the poor performances displayed in the NBA Finals were keeping those of us who frequently post on the boards away from the NBA Finals thread (or at least that was how I interpreted it at the time).

I chose to make an assumption that the poor NBA scheduling might also have an impact on those of us who would post regularly on the boards.

Again, it might not be the exact reason, but it is plausible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
I'm not sure if you're referring to the board or the players. The scheduling, which does indeed suck, aside, if it's the board you meant, it apparently is the lack of highlight reel basketball which is today's type entertainment...I just don't buy into the spread out schedule as being the reason. More like the quality of the product today's fans wants is lacking
I understand my statement that I "think most of the lack of interest comes from how long the NBA playoffs seem to go on far" was too vague, but it was meant to address the lack of posting that was seen in the thread early on in the series.

If you were confused, I apologize. In my following post I cleared up the issue of what I was referring to by saying that "I believe the lack of interest on the board is because it becomes tough to become emotionally involved in this series, because of the poor NBA scheduling."

But even if you were confused, you still addressed the issue by saying "you don't buy into the spread out schedule as being the reason," and claimed "the quality of the product today's fan wants is lacking."

The way you cast "aside" my assumption, informing me that "you don't buy" it, led to my unappealing tone when I said "Excuse me if I don't jump on the fans are turned off by the product bandwagon."

Yet, instead of casting aside your opinions so quickly, I decided to back up my statement by showing the television ratings that prove that interest in the NBA Finals this year was up from a year ago (regardless of how minute that increase might have been).

I also stated that what the majority of today's NBA fans want to see in the NBA Finals was present this year. They wanted to see Shaquille O'Neal. They wanted to see Dwyane Wade. They wanted to see Mark Cuban (most of these points were later backed up by statements made later in thread concerning interest in the finals by Shawn, Sue and Billy).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
Is there ever a post you make that isn't 95% stat laden? Stats are not stand alone solutions to a debate..I don't waste my time with frivilous stat finding
I am in awe that you have only had one "truly heatedly" arguement with one previous member on the boards, if it is your policy to belittle the individual posters for their style of posting, and lambasting any effort they choose to put into their posts as "frivolous."

Let it be known at this point in our "debate" that I had made no personal attacks nor comments towards you (only using an unappealing tone that I addressed above). I focused solely on the information within your posts, and chose to respond solely to those points.

Their might be some "mighty vicious, hurtful and nasty comments in threads" but they are not from me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
Then you use that skewed stat that you apparently take for some sort of stamp of quality & say the quality is there on the floor.
First, I have never skewed any stat. I mentioned the 13% increase in television ratings just to show that interest was up in this series from a year ago. Regardless of whether you feel that is a valid point, and regardless of how minute the increase might truly be, their is no denying the point that interest was up in this year's series when compared to a year ago. That is a fact.

Furthermore, I never said the quality of basketball in this series should now be considered great because people are tuning into the broadcasts. I said people were watching the series because they were interested in the players involved, not necessarily a flawless, well-played "quality" basketball game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
Besides, if this 'Quality" you say is on the floor is what the fans are clamoring for, these sure aren't basketall fans.
Comments like this truly upset me because I don't know what gives you the right to determine who is and who isn't a basketball fan.

And it is also important to note the quote provided by you above, considering that in your last post you said "nowhere did I say that if any fan wanted something different that they weren't basketball fans."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
You say you've noticed a lack of quality yet don't spend all that stat time in finding where the quality started to wane.
I didn't feel I needed to spend the time gathering stats when I admitted that I agreed with you and buckeye that the quality of play "has been lacking for some time in the NBA." Besides, I was simply trying to address the issue at hand of why people on the boards decided not to post frequently.





I want to stop right here and mention that I have spent this much time on this post and all of this was simply skipped over in your assessment of the situation above. I want to clear up this mess, and move on.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
So now you offer up a reason that "it's tough to become emotionally involved". It's funny, but to a point I agree, tho it isn't cuz of scheduling which I'll reiterate is piss poor but cuz that's what today's fans are trained for.
Statements like these also upset me because you take the time to debunk my stance, yet offer no explanation as to why you agree that it is tough for fans to become emotionally involved.

You even go on to say that being emotionally involved shouldn't be a criteria for basketball fans, and is only something needed to draw in the casual viewers. I agree with this statement, but this board is filled with casual fans who need to be emotionally involved in the series in order to make posts about it.

Again, I have always tried to stick to the actual issue at hand on why people on the boards decided not to post frequently during the series.





Now I need to skip ahead to your last post...




Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarkus
while we both were "warned", somehow you continue this charade unopposed & unchecked
We were both warned following our emotional statements to each other by Shawn, and I might have gone unopposed since, but I am sure it is because I didn't go on a verbal assault against Shawn.

I didn't tell a moderator not to chastise me, to cut the crap and to quit flexing his mod muscles. Nor did I tell the moderator that he has an egotistical style of moderation, and acknowledge that I have an utter disrespect for the moderators misuse of mod duties, and credited the moderator for the instigation of things between you and I going further.

If you get banned, I will definitely not revel in the fact. I think you are a great contributor to the boards and I have thoroughly enjoyed some of your posts.

But any issue that might involve you being banned is solely between you and Shawn, and doesn't need my name drug into it.



Also, it is interesting to me that buckeye and I have not had to resort to an emotional state throughout this topic of discussion. I felt it was important to point out that last year's final was not the lowest-rated series of all-time (which buckeye previously stated in this thread), and that he "skewed" the stats when he said this year will rank as the third lowest-rated series of all-time. I appreciate buckeye's research and I am glad he informed me that the 1980 and 1981 NBA Finals series' were on tape delay. But the information and statistics based on both mine and buckeye's "frivolous" research is now available for all to see and make a judgment call with.




I also find it interesting that you say I just showed up "for a cheap debate" and was trying to "drum up an arguement" with my comments, even though they addressed a specific issue that you chose to bring up. My comments were not "sorely misplaced," but were simply an assumption based off an assumption you made as to why I thought people were choosing not to post.

It was that simple, and could have been left to that.




I am not a "seer" and have never claimed to know the reasoning for why people chose not to post during the series (I decided simply to offer up an assumption).

You, on the other hand, apparently did know that it had nothing to do with the poor scheduling, and instead said it was quality of the product. I don't like putting words into other poster's mouth (so if they disagree, they are more than welcome to correct me), but Shawn, Sue and Billy all seemed to disagree with your feelings and noted that it was the product being offered this year that kept them interested in the series.

I am not trying to pit you against a couple of members. I was just showing you that some people agreed with me that they were more interested this year because of the product on the basketball floor. Again, if they disagree, they are more than welcome to correct me.



It is also important to note that I never once tried to say that "stats win all" in an arguement, but I do believe statistics (like buckeye at times chooses to show) do aid in illustrating a point.

Nobody had to "jump on my bandwagon" and accept my feelings on why their was a lack of posting during the series as a fact. But nobody had to cast aside and denigrate my statements, provoke me to respond and retaliate with personal attacks, either.




I come to these boards because I enjoy reading the opinions of people who I respect (yourself included, Tarkus), and I hope they can also accept contrary views from people that are just as well informed and by people who also put thoughtful consideration into their posts.

If people agree with you Tarkus and feel like I am "trolling" or "trumpeting up lies," then I will gladly remove myself from these boards.

Otherwise, I look forward to reading more of the thoughts and the opinions of the tremendous people who do post and debate on these boards on a daily basis without having to resort to personal attacks with those with differing views.




Sorry for dragging this out, but I do want to thank everyone else for being considerate and understanding.







************EDITED******** because when you write a post a mile long, their is bound to be a spelling mistake somewhere.

Last edited by tobynosker; 06-22-2006 at 10:37 AM.
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Old 06-22-2006, 10:39 AM   #155
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For what it's worth, I for one would hate to see either of you leave the boards. :whine: You both bring a lot of knowledge and humor to SC and I really enjoy reading both of your posts......

Just make up already!!!!!!:lol:
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Old 06-22-2006, 10:48 AM   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suedon1970
Just make up already!!!!!!
Okay...but only one condition.

No tongue!!!!!
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Old 06-22-2006, 11:08 AM   #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tobynosker
Okay...but only one condition.

No tongue!!!!!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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