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Old 06-19-2003, 12:48 AM   #1
chevy706
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Default ACC courting Virginia Tech!

Several unnamed sources have told the AP and ESPN.com that the ACC now plans on including Virginia Tech in their plans for expansion. Plans may include adding a 5th team, with speculations being UConn or Louisville, to make it a 14 team conference.

"Big East spokesperson Mark Fabiani says that they have repeatedly received assurance that Virginia Tech is committed to protecting the Big East and that they could not, in good conscience, accept an invitation from the ACC."

Ok, a few things here. Even as a Big East fan, when the lawsuit against the ACC was made, I couldn't see the ACC as on a mission to destroy the Big East. But trying to take as many as 5 of our 8 football teams?!?! I think this only helps the Big East's case against the ACC.

Second, it's become abundantly clear the only reason for VTs inclusion is to win UVA's vote in favor of expansion, thus giving the ACC its required 7 yes votes.

Does the inclusion of VT in the latest expansion plan mean that VT and the state of Virginia drop their names from the lawsuit?

Does anyone else see the only possible results from this as either total destruction of the Big East or a devastating loss by the ACC? If the ACC fails to expand, it is almost certain FSU runs off to another conference, as they have threatened before.

I hope that making this its own thread instead of dumping it in the ACC/Big East thread doesn't upset anybody, but since it's a whole new break in the story, I thought it important to devote a thread to it.
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Old 06-19-2003, 03:25 AM   #2
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I just finished noting it in the ACC expansion thread, but no big.

This is doom for the Big East. Torn to shreds if this goes down.
I, for one, fully believe that Swofford went in with the intention of destroying the Big East, chevy. And this development only supports the idea.

This makes me want to give up on college athletics altogether.

If I were of the remaining Big East schools, I might be willing to shut down some sports and put that money into legally beating the absolute hell out of Swofford, the ACC, the yes-voting schools, the abandoner schools, and Miles Brand and the NCAA for failure to intercede when the integrity of college athletics was on the line. I'd be highly motivated to refuse to play any of the abandoning schools for the remainder of their conference membership, and would refuse to pay their way.

This has me wondering what the f*ck is wrong with these people.

I sincerely hope VT wakes up tomorrow and says, "NO! We could never join you!!"

Dave
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Old 06-19-2003, 08:46 AM   #3
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Wow...and here it seemed that the ACC was just going to invite Miami, as a compromise. Interesting they are going back on the offensive....a BIG offensive. An offensive offensive, for Big East fans.
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Old 06-19-2003, 02:14 PM   #4
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An offensive offensive against all college athletics, Kevin. Isn't it bad enough that the Big 6 have made insignificant the members of the Other 5? Is it really the case that college athletics has come to the point where conferences no longer want to beat one another on the field/on the court/in whatever sporting venue, but now to ELIMINATE competition for $$$ by going on a pillage and plunder expedition of other conferences?

I've said it before, I'll say it again: Roy Kramer started the downfall of college athletics. What the ACC is doing is merely an extension of his move to destroy the SWC a dozen years ago.

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Old 06-19-2003, 08:07 PM   #5
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Dave...

First off, I think the SWC was dismantled in 96, if memory serves, with the Big 8 getting the Texas teams, including Baylor, courtesy of Texas politicians who wanted the private school with no hopes of winning anything EVER in, and Arkansas going to the SEC, so that conference could be the super mega money making bloated -can't-keep-track-of who is who conference that it is.

This is sickening and disgusting, I agree there Dave. I just got done watching ( perhaps chevy saw a little of it too) Sportsbeat with Stan Savran and they had Beano Cook on there. Here is what they said in a nutshell...

1. It's over. The ACC is going to go after UCONN, not Louisville, as chevy reported earlier. The reason behind this is that UCONN is the biggest complainer in the lawsuit because they got themselves all dolled up for I-A ball and now have no dance to go too. If UCONN, which they will because life revolves around $, gets the invite to the ACC and excepts, which is a sly move on the ACC'S part, then the lawsuit loses what little bite it had.

2. The votes are there, perhaps even without VT, but VT is going to put it over the top. as Virginia will say yes with VT in the deal. They said that Duke and UNC will proably say no, and maybe another, but its it a done deal.

3. The ACC will have proably 13 teams in it and that is the cap. Just reporting what they said.

4. Pitt and WVU are screwed. The Big Ten doesn't want them and Beano said that it would be better for them to go it as independants after the raping is done by the ACC. Cook claims, and I proably agree to this, that it is perhaps a better option to go independant ( of course WVU and Pitt would battle each year, so that's one game), then bring in your Louisville's, Cincy's, or Memphis', $ wise, AT THE VERY LEAST, IN FOOTBALL TERMS. B-ball might not be that bad, but football would be a mess.

5. Scheduling for independants is tough. This is the kicker here. If you go independant, you are going to have a tough time getting teams to play you, especially if you are having a good run. I guess playing different lower I-A teams each year at Heinz is better then playing the same lower I-A teams each year, according to Cook and Savran. Wow, we are talking pretty pathetic scenarios here if you ask me.

Just updating on what I've heard. I am inclined to believe that the ACC will win, there will be 12 to 13 ACC teams and then the attention will turn to the remaining Big East teams and what they want to do. I have a feeling it will disband if they lose the shear number of teams that we are now talking about. No conferences really want new teams now, aside of perhaps Conf USA, but what kind of fate is that? They will either go independant or play in a depleted conference, one so depleted now with the talk of so many defectors, that perhaps that automatic BCS bid may go out the window...

It should be interesting. And at the same time, sad and disgusting.
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Old 06-19-2003, 08:58 PM   #6
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I'm confused....you're saying the UCONN and VT are BOTH getting invited? If so, that's *5* teams getting invited, along with the original Miami, Syracuse and BC, bringing the ACC up to 14 teams...or is one of the original 3 getting disinvited?
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Old 06-19-2003, 08:59 PM   #7
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Sounds bleak. I don't always buy everything Beano says, but I'd say he's right in the take you presented here. IF there is another no, that would be interesting, but from what I've read, Duke and UNC are alone in the tobacco fields here.

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Old 06-20-2003, 02:40 PM   #8
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Kevin...according to the Cook and Savran, 14 TEAMS could be in. Yes, 14. That is one damn high number, but the idea here.

New ACC would be...

Florida St.
Duke
North Carolina
North Carolina St.
Maryland
Clemson
Wake Forrest
Georgia Tech
Virginia
* Virginia Tech
* UCONN
* Miami
* Syracuse
* Boston College

Bloated beyond belief. UCONN just came up yesterday as a ploy by the ACC to take away the Big East's most " damaged" school out of the lawsuit. These guys know what they are doing.

This would leave the Big East with...

Pittsburgh
West Virginia
Rutgers
Temple

OUCH ! Let's say my five defectors do indeed jump ship. Does Louisville, Cincy, and even say a Memphis do anything here, football wise? Just looking at it in print makes me agree with Cook and Savran. At this point, WVU and Pitt HAVE to go independant because no other conferences, ok maybe CONF USA, want anyone right now. CONF USA is just too low IMO.

In a related matter, Cook and Savran also agreed that if the Big Ten wants to ever expand, which they don't now, their first choice is Notre Dame, very obvious there, but both said Missouri, and not Pitt or WVU is a more attractive school for the invite if they ever wanted another team.
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Old 06-20-2003, 03:12 PM   #9
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I've actually heard rumors floating around that the Big 10+1 would consider expansion to 12 or 14 teams if the ACC deal goes through. I've also heard that both the SEC and Big 12 are flirting with the idea of 14, depending on how it works out for the ACC. The super-conference may be here before you know it.
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Old 06-23-2003, 03:02 PM   #10
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I would tend to agree, 78, that Pitt and WVU would likely be better off going independent, unless they opted to join C-USA. Not sure what would become of the Big East basketball schools, but they can't be even a little joyed by a 14-team scenario.

I think at the end of the day, the ACC will invite only Miami. Duke & UNC will likely buy that, and UVa doesn't have to have the deciding vote then, so their life is made that much easier. They get to vote NO because VT gets left behind, and no one notices or cares, because everyone else bought the Cane bait.

Meanwhile, I think it becomes incumbent on Tranghese to determine whether there should even BE a Big East football conference, and if not, to start making arrangements to return the Big East to its previous basketball-only glory. Grabbing Louisville basketball would be one step. Someone certifying C-USA as a BCS conference upon dissolution of the Big East football conference and the carryover into C-USA of at least VT, WVU and/or Pitt would be the steps 2A and 2B. Rutgers and Temple taking their football programs offline or to division 1-AA is another step. I could give three full craps what Uconn does with their football program, don't give half a damn what BC does with their football, and wouldn't be shocked if Syracuse became a moderately attractive team for the Big 10+1 to recruit, on the assumption that ND continues its "I'll never join you!!" stance.

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Old 06-23-2003, 09:37 PM   #11
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Quick, and brief update: Judge will hear preliminary arguments on THURSDAY.
I just realized that the clock is ticking on this deal, if they're to move after next year. They have one week from today to dole invites and for the invitees to tell the Big East that they are vile, repugnant "collegians."

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Old 06-23-2003, 10:50 PM   #12
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I'm guessing, at this point, the ACC will either back down from completely ravaging the Big East, or the judge will prevent them, so I'm putting my money on either the Miami-only scenario, or the Miami-Cuse-VT scenario. Either way, the Big East has fought so hard on this that I don't expect them to lay down and fold, football-wise. Look for them to go ahead and take Louisville, and possibly Cincinnati, and just try to stay afloat football-wise.
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Old 06-24-2003, 10:37 PM   #13
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Interesting thoughts. However, did you see the piece on spn.com by Pat Forde today?

I've actually been mulling things like this in my head, wondering if C-USA might be well-poised to boast a BCS-worthy position, if the Big East were to die (Die==Miami, VT, Syracuse, and BC all jump ship) if they devoured the Big East.

Anyway... so it's out there. I'm not the only wondering...

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Old 06-25-2003, 08:32 PM   #14
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As a Hokie, I'm going to be extremely disappointed if VT jumps to the ACC. How dare VT threaten to sue other schools thinking of leaving, then grab the next offer!!

The whole thing makes me sick.
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Old 06-25-2003, 11:08 PM   #15
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Agreed. Virginia Tech's position proves how much "principle" was behind this lawsuit. They weren't suing for peace, they were cranky that they didn't get invited to the prom, while their prettier older sister did.

I already mentioned the possibility of, thanks to the move, Pitt or someone getting a BCS bowl at 7-5 while a Colorado State(for example), gets shut out at 12-0.

But, now I'm evisioning another possibility that is just as bad....
The BCS *immediately* strips the Big East of their BCS position and then...well, we can talk about the viability of the Big East remaining in the BCS, or C-USA jumping up to it, but I think the NCAA would see the most dollar signs in adding another *at-large bid.* Now, Colorado State will be left out at the hands of, say, 9-3 Nebraska instead.
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