Go Back   Sports Central Message Boards > Collegiate Sports Discussion > College Football

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-04-2003, 12:00 AM   #1
Bama_AL
Grizzled Veteran
 
Bama_AL's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Alabama
Posts: 88
Bama_AL is on a distinguished road
Default I got a question

Suppose you're in charge of the SEC. If you decide to drop Vanderbilt and pick up another team to keep 12 teams in the SEC, who do you pick and why?
Bama_AL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2003, 12:45 AM   #2
KevinBeane
Sports Virtuoso
 
KevinBeane's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Newark DE/Akron OH
Posts: 3,651
KevinBeane is on a distinguished road
Default

Good question. We have been analyzing similar, hypothetical changes to other conferences in other threads.

First, I'm going to assume that none of the ACC schools will bolt, now that they just brought Miami aboard, and I don't think any Big 12 schools would leave either. That leaves, as far as teams that make geographical sense, Conference USA teams and what's left of the Big East.

It seems to me that there is only one decent choice in each league. In Conference USA, Louisville would enhance their rivalry with Kentucky by joining the SEC, and would complement SEC basketball well. They would be a football liability though, perhaps no better than Vandy.

In the Big East, Virginia Tech would be a HUGE trade-off over Vandy in football, and would compete at the top echelons of the SEC right away. However, VT has been absolutely terrible as a basketball member of the Big East, and the SEC is (slightly, in my opinion) a stronger basketball conference than the Big East was. It's also probably be stretching the SEC geographical limits as far as it can go, as Virginia only shares one (very thin) border with an SEC state, Tennessee.

Still, that border is good enough for me, and football is the name of the game. I go with Virginia Tech.
__________________
SLANT PATTERN
2004 SCMB FANTASY GOLF, NFL POINTSPREAD CHAMPION

"I believe in [a] God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with fates and actions of human beings." -Albert Einstein
KevinBeane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2003, 10:14 AM   #3
I OWN THIS
The True Titan
 
I OWN THIS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Southaven, Mississippi
Posts: 2,634
I OWN THIS is on a distinguished road
Default

The only ones that have a good chance at being SEC members from C-USA would be Louisville, Southern Miss, and Memphis. Memphis has a decent basketball program that might be able to compete there, but their football program is worse than Vandy's so count them out. Southern Miss could compete football wise in the conference, but their struggles would be huge in basketball. Plus I really don't think Mississippi should have 3 schools in the SEC. Finally, Louisville is the best fit for reasons Kevin mentioned in basketball, and they are a better program than Vandy in football.

If the SEC ever dropped Vandy and picked up another team, I wanted them to pick up Miami or FSU....obviously that is not going to happen.

I just can't picture Va Tech being in the SEC really, and I like the idea of Louisville being in the SEC more than I do Va Tech. So, my choice would be Louisville.

Joey
__________________
Tennesse Titans Superbowl Champs 2003...Steve Mcnair for NFL MVP...Hopefully the Gators can compete in the SEC
I OWN THIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2003, 12:30 AM   #4
MountaineerDave
Where am I?
 
MountaineerDave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 5,661
MountaineerDave is on a distinguished road
Default

So, there have to be some criteria for making a choice; it can't just be arbitrary. Dropping an obvious poor fit for the conference with another poor fit makes no sense. So, in my opinion, these are the criteria:

1. Stable, top 35 football program
2. Stable, top 40 basketball program
3. Public schools preferred. Vandy is the only private school in the SEC.
4. Large school attendance.
5. Moderate to large stadium.
6. Better than 80% attendance/capacity, preferring, of course, the SEC standard of 99% attendance/capacity.
7. Southern state, preferably Kentucky or south, and not extending further west than Louisiana.

The obvious first choice is to give the ACC a taste of its own medicine, and steal its current crown jewel, Florida State. FSU falls short in basketball, but perhaps with SEC support, FSU could build up the program.

Another ACC program that's a relatively good fit (but better where it is) is Georgia Tech. Talk about giving Georgia-Georgia Tech rivalry some teeth... But, Georgia Tech as an institution fits better in the ACC. At least with Florida State, there's some question as to its overall fitness with the ACC.

A C-USA team heretofore left out of the discussion, but an intriguing prospect anyway, might be Southern Miss. The basketball program lacks, but geographically, it's a beauty fit. The school itself might be on the small side, and maybe not a perfect academic fit, but is certainly a athletic program in the money-making athletics, anyway, than Vandy. They'd need to work a little on attendance, I think, but in five to ten years or so when Brett Favre is the coach there (an obvious plus and draw), I doubt that will be an issue.

If not for a flailing football program, Memphis is a decent fit. Overall, I think its athletics are a question mark, really. They've had recent basketball success, but...

Louisville's a nice fit, but for some reason, doesn't scream SEC to me. It fits most of the criteria I've divined pretty well. Like I said, it's a fairly obvious choice, doesn't create East/West division issues the way Southern Miss would... I just don't view it as an SEC school, for some reason.

A stretch, I'll admit, but not one to be discounted completely out of hand, is to grab Georgia Southern from division 1-AA. They would need a MUCH larger stadium. At 18,000 currently, they would by far be the little sister in the conference. They have expansion plans to 50,000, but don't appear to be in a hurry to make that move. While Ga Southern would have some work to do to be competitive, especially in the SEC, they have some fearsome football tradition, and have had good basketball periodically. As far as div1-aa football goes, there are only three teams that ever occur to me: Marshall (who made the move up to div1-a), Youngstown State, and Georgia Southern.

I think the SEC would contemplate a Miami grab, despite the school being a non-starter on any but one of the critieria I set forth above.

Anyway, that's my forty-five cents and 1 1/2 hr of research and writing.

Dave
__________________
mountaineerdave on twitter
mountaineerdavem on AIM
MountaineerDave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2003, 08:40 AM   #5
tigereyes33
War Damn Eagle!!!!
 
tigereyes33's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Dunwoody, GA
Posts: 663
tigereyes33 is on a distinguished road
Default

I think that if the SEC added another good team in football, they would be too competitive and nobody could go undefeated, and that would take away national titles, so I don't think they should drop or add anybody.
__________________
2 in a row over those dawgs
AND 4 IN A ROW OVER THE TIDE!!!!!!!!
Doesn't get any better than that
tigereyes33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2003, 03:42 PM   #6
MountaineerDave
Where am I?
 
MountaineerDave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 5,661
MountaineerDave is on a distinguished road
Default

I think the following teams could afford to be kicked out of their respective conferences for not fitting into the conference's overall image:
1. Vanderbilt (private school, poor athletics, in an athletic state school conference)
2. Northwestern (same argument as for Vandy)
3. Florida State(this is a tough call, but FSU's academics are what make me wonder here; Clemson's academics are on par, if not a little behind FSU, so the argument is weakened there. Basketball sucks, will likely always suck. Same for Clemson. Toss 'em both? At least the academic FOCUS of FSU is a fit, where Clemson trails even there)
4. Baylor (Private school in a state school conference)
5. Penn State (on geography alone, otherwise, despite 78's protestations, a good fit)
6. Central Florida (geography; in fact, let's rename the MAC the Rust Belt conference and be done with it)
7. Louisiana Tech (geography)
8. Idaho (geography; when did Idaho fit into the Sun Belt. Talk about a stretch)

C-USA has no one cast out, because the conference is nothing more than a mish-mash of a dozen disconnected schools wishing they had somewhere else to go.
PAC10 is the only perfect conference. If the Pac10 academics were a little less lackluster, Stanford would stand out as a private school with strong academics in a state school's conference. However, the overall strength of Stanford's athletic department despite being a private school make it a solid particpant in the conference.

The argument against losses, 33, is that it then becomes incumbent on the SEC to schedule tough out-of-conference games, and prove their mettle there by winning non-conference games against teams that would otherwise be title contenders.
If it became a real problem, e.g., Miami wins 5 straight titles with a bullsh** ACC schedule while playing Big Least and WAC non-conference games, there's no reason that the NCAA couldn't start instituting some scheduling rules beyond the current ones. One could actually envision a year-by-year system where the NCAA forces non-conference matchups based on previous year (or some couple years, to increase fairness) performance, if a conference with would-be perennial contenders lose out year after year. Unfortunately, such complaining would probably just bolster the playoff argument.

Dave
__________________
mountaineerdave on twitter
mountaineerdavem on AIM
MountaineerDave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2003, 08:37 PM   #7
KevinBeane
Sports Virtuoso
 
KevinBeane's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Newark DE/Akron OH
Posts: 3,651
KevinBeane is on a distinguished road
Default

LOL. I agree that the MAC should be called the Rust Betl conference (Akron and Toledo, Ohio, Muncie, Indiana, and now Orlando? What glamour! Let's give them all factory jobs when they leave school.

And, clearly, the Sun Belt is an incredible whore of a conference. Most conferences will at least make a NOD in the direction of geography...the Sun Belt has make it clear they will take ALL comers, and isn't it only a six hour drive from Idaho to Florida Anyway??? ;-)
__________________
SLANT PATTERN
2004 SCMB FANTASY GOLF, NFL POINTSPREAD CHAMPION

"I believe in [a] God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with fates and actions of human beings." -Albert Einstein
KevinBeane is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:07 AM.